Is there a rule against: Mechanical Devices to assist!

[george]

I know that I have seen tournament rules in the past against using mechanical devices to assist in hooking or catching a tournament fish.
Wouldn't the new Livingston Lures line up be a mechanical device that assist you in hooking or catching.
They have a computer type chip that emits a bait fish sound which draws fish to them, this would be mechanically enhanced in my opinion.
I think Livingston lures are a great product and I will buy a few at some point, but am I wrong in thinking that they are in the mechanical assist category.

George

[Otay Michael]

97 reads at this point and no comments!

Guess it's a 'can of worms'.

Seems 'just shy of live bait' to me, maybe even EQUAL?

[jg]

How is that differnt than using graphs to see fish and then catch them? Is not a rattle in the bait the same thing it is something that is machined to rattle back and forth and make noise to entice a strike.

[george]

Hey jg! I think that with other baits the angler must impart the action and or sound that a lure makes by his skill or intentional movement. If you cast out a spook and reel it in via a straight line you wont be as successful as if you walk the dog with it.
If you cast any lure out for that matter you must make that lure do something; from a fast retrieve to a variable retrieve to a slow retrieve or even dead sticking it.

Seems like these lures could be cast out and while just sitting there they will emit sounds, sounds of a bait fish which on their own will draw bass to them.
I am in no way putting Livingston Lures down, they have come up with a great innovation and a product that I will use, I am just asking if BASS banned the A-Rig than why would this lure be allowed in competition. I see it as much more of an advantage than an A-Rig.

I posted this subject for the sake of conversation and debate, thanks for your opinion.

George

[jg]

Well your right but I feel everything we use is mechanical. What is a reel? Should we not have to hand line if we can not use anything mechanical to catch fish. My opinion of the rule you have read would mean setting a rod in a device that sets the hook for you. Or maybe something that you push the button to set the hooking motion. Out side of that if your on a bass boat pretty much everything is mechanical. On that note I have never read that rule in any of the stuff I have fished. Fun topic tho.

[Big Buddy]

Livingston lures are so new most people would still not know about them if one of their lures was not used to help win the Bassmaster Classic. There has been so much hype about them ever since. I'm sure that if the computer chip inside their baits makes anglers catch fish like crazy like an A-Rig, BASS will prolly ban them too!!

[Revoke36]

The hydro wave is similar in nature to the Livingston lures concept. Those are permissible in tourneys. I don't see why the lure can't as well unless they rule out the hydro wave too

[scott39]

I would say anything but live bait is good to go. Take the a rig for example. I think it was all a marketing ploy with all the banning talk. I fish the motherlode. I have thrown a rig till I'm blue in the face. It catches no more fish than a jerkbait for me. If the bass want to eat they will eat. The real advantage is being able to see a fish in the middle of a brush pile. Nobody is talking about that.

[adman]

Not to be pedantic, but a chip is in no way mechanical. It is electronic. Mechanical might be something that physically grabbed a fish, or snapped shut on the jaw, etc. So to the degree that accurate terminology is important to rules or laws, the Livingston lures are clearly not in violation of any current rule.

[mark poulson]

If it is a huge advantage that results in wholesale catches of bass, it will be banned from the major trails, and regulated by the local DFG's, who actually do care about our fisheries.

[DL]

Using a boat to move to inaccessible areas of a body of water is a mechanical advantage. So is using a reel, a rod, line, and a hook. the list is endless. Unless you are using your mouth, feet, or hands to catch fish, you are using a mechanical advantage.

Noodling is the only pure form of fishing in the united states...

[mark poulson]

Noodling is the only pure form of fishing in the united states...

That's scary!!!

[george]

Ok, lets say I come up with a fishing line that has a fiber optic in it that lights up a LED on my reel when a fish touches it and a lure that puts out an electric charge and once I hook a fish it zaps them so they don't fight to the net! The fish voluntarily took the bait and my lure minimized his ability to fight which gave me an advantage of not having the fish pull off during a tug a war.
Based on the opinion's and thought process here this should be totally legal in tournament and sport fishing!
Again, I think the Livingston lure is a great innovation, sort of the same thing that one of Ike's sponsor with the infrared light came up with a few years ago. This Livingston lures product just seems to work better!
Where does the technology stop and the skill come back into play in tournament bass fishing!

We have electronics that allow you to virtually see the structure, cover and fish you are trying to catch, we have sound machines ringing the dinner bell that draw them to the boat now we have lures that have the ability to act on their own.

George

[merc1997]

this an very interesting subject. if we do not stop somewhere, we are going to take the actual human skills out of the competition. for tournament purposes, i am really not in favor of any electronic calling device,ie. devices such as hydrowave. bass tournaments used to truly be who had the best skills at locating and catching bass. i am not for sure about that anymore. the ways things are now, you might as well allow chumming, live bait, multiple rods, and trolling. at least in my part of the world, there are many tourney fisherman that are trolling when they drag a jig or c-rig around all day with the troller. since tourney officials just turn a deaf ear to what is going on, i rarely fish any tournaments anymore.

i could easily win a whole bunch of tournaments during bedding season by using an aqua view to aid in catching them off the bed. i do not see any difference in that than using a hydro wave. just my opinion about the future of bass tournaments.

bo

[adman]

Perhaps I've missed something. It seems everyone here is convinced or knows for a fact that the hydrowave or these lures are actually effective. Every time I have read a discussion re: them the reviews are mixed about 50/50. I know KVD owns hydrowave and I'm pretty sure he has given one to every elite guy so if they are all using this dangerously effective tool, why do some still blank, some do ok and others win? I may be a bit cynical but i find the notion that someone has been able to record and simulate sounds so that attracting fish is guaranteed a bit hard to swallow. Sounds like something usually sold on late night infomertials. Who knows maybe they work, just seems unlikely.

This discussion seems to parallel the a-rig debate, which seems to have abated since not every tournament is won solely by an a-rig. Not every tournament is won on a crankbait either for that matter. I just fail to see how any one "thing" is going to completely change the basic nature of fishing.

I noticed on the livingston site one of byron's commercials equates the Livinston lure to a duck call, which calls ducks and the lure supposedly calls fish. So are duck calls equally unfair?

But all this discussion about how unfair this latest "magic lure" is will do one thing - make livingston lures a very successful company, at least for awhile.

[george]

Hey Bo, how is everything? Hope you guys are getting a little warmer back there!

I would like to see a major tournament of the Elite guys or even FLW where everyone has to fish without electronics or devices of any type and see who comes too the top. I would bet it would be some of the good ol boys who have been around for years and know how to read the water and evaluate the situation from old fashioned experience.

George

PS; My nephew Zac Azevedo and his partner Kyle caught them pretty good at Clear Lake at the FPT TOC on the Nutech Jigs I gave them, they just couldn't get that one big bite each day but got a lot of fours and fives.

[Scott Robertson]

I have bought a couple of livington Cankbaits, have thrown them a few times. Other than they run realy true and easy to fish with, they also look great in the water. I have not caught any more fish with them than I have a lucky craft or a fat free shad. I cant say that i have spent hours and hours with them ,but good lure yes, magical not not covinced yet.
Scott

[Brian D.]

As Adman stated, there is nothing mechanical about Livingston Lures. It emits sound only. Over the decades there have been many lures that make noise whether it be with a battery/chip, a pitched prop/blade, or with placing holes in the bait to make more bubbles.

Laser Lures had their 3 months of fame and spent a bunch of money to get some market share. Where are they now... in the bargain bin of Wal-mart. Sponsor money has dried up and the pros have moved on.

I don't even know why i got sucked into this topic. I hate myself.

[adman]

Brian, you were just bored out of your mind. It happens to all of us, like when I read "comments" to ANY story on the internet that allows comments. Like watching a train wreck.

[mteman]

It's all chum!
Electronic chum but still chum.
is there a rule against chum?

Definition of CHUM
transitive verb
: to attract with chum
intransitive verb
: to throw chum overboard to attract fish

[merc1997]

Hey Bo, how is everything? Hope you guys are getting a little warmer back there!

I would like to see a major tournament of the Elite guys or even FLW where everyone has to fish without electronics or devices of any type and see who comes too the top. I would bet it would be some of the good ol boys who have been around for years and know how to read the water and evaluate the situation from old fashioned experience.

George

PS; My nephew Zac Azevedo and his partner Kyle caught them pretty good at Clear Lake at the FPT TOC on the Nutech Jigs I gave them, they just couldn't get that one big bite each day but got a lot of fours and fives.

george, i saw a short clip of an interview with them. hope that the NuJig was a big help in catching their bass. i caught 7 keepers this afternoon on the 3/16 stuffed inside a gitzit. fished all afternoon with the same jig and gitzit. guess where everyone of them was hooked.

bo

[dwise]

Even with all the electronics, side & down imaging, hydrowave, Livingston crankbaits you still have to find the fish before you can catch them and even if you find the fish, they may not be in the mood to bite whatever you throw at them.

[merc1997]

well, lets just make dynamite legal. after all it is an attractant. it attracts them to the top. for non- competitive fishing perhaps it is a non-issue. but, for tournament fishing, i think there needs to be a line drawn in the sand so to speak.

i am with george. lets have a tournament that no electronics can be used. if you need to check the depth, do it with your rod and reel and line.

bo

[mark poulson]

I'm sure the tournament organizations and, more importantly, the participating anglers will stay on top of these things, and, if they are a significant advantage, they will deal with them, like the A rig.
No one is going to pay to compete for that kind of money with the deck stacked against them.