trolling, live bait - why is it banned?

kopper_bass · Post by **kopper_bass** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:19 am

We were out on the Delta yesterday doing our usual thing and we saw a guy in a Johnboat trolling along the tulles for bass or stripers. Not sure which, but he certainly wasnt catching them, as we were flipping and whacking fish just near him.

This got me thinking - "Why in Bass tournaments (all of them) is it really illegal and considered unsportsman-like to troll"? Then that got me thinking even more "Why no live bait"?

Now, before you reply with the obvious answer, think about it. It's not illegal. It certainly takes skill to master all the variables. Its no guarantee.

Is trolling so easy to catch bass, that it would outproduce anything else? Does using a live minnow 100% guarantee you the big bite on the Delta or Clear Lake? Who would you put money on to bring in a big sack on the Delta, the worlds best trolling guy, or Dee Thomas?

Think about all the other sport fishing events out there, (most are salt water) and all of them employ using bait, trolling, chumming, ... almost any legal means is accepted and promoted.

So, who knows the "real" reason why these things are not accepted in Bass fishing tournaments?

Curious,

Kopper_Bass

Bill kizer · Post by **Bill kizer** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:40 am

If all you did was throw minnows and crawdads how can we justify to our wives all the money we spend on tackle.

Greg_Cornish · Post by **Greg_Cornish** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:56 am

Bill kizer wrote:If all you did was throw minnows and crawdads how can we justify to our wives all the money we spend on tackle.

ECKZACKLY.

Tin Can · Post by **Tin Can** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:03 am

Fishing live bait doesn't guarantee you will catch a bunch of big bass, but any idiot can chuck a shiner on a bobber and have a much better chance at catching fish than say an inexperience angler would if they were only using artificial baits.

In short, live bait fishing is MUCH easier.

Cooch · Post by **Cooch** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:08 am

kopper_bass wrote: So, who knows the "real" reason why these things are not accepted in Bass fishing tournaments?

Curious, Kopper_Bass

Blame RAY SCOTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tin Can · Post by **Tin Can** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:14 am

Hey Cooch, would you use live bait in a tourney if it was allowed and if not how would you feel about fishing against other guys who were using it?

Barry Watson · Post by **Barry Watson** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:21 am

I suppose it would not be much of a business if all they sold were bobbers and hooks. Speaking of bobbers, I have some in my antique tackle collection that even set the hook for you. Another deal called Bait-Life that you stuff your minner in and chunk it out. Jerk on the line and the bait drops out below the bobber. Supposed to keep the shiner from getting killed when you make a long cast. LOL

Buzzbait · Post by **Buzzbait** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:26 am

Tin Can wrote:Fishing live bait doesn't guarantee you will catch a bunch of big bass, but any idiot can chuck a shiner on a bobber and have a much better chance at catching fish than say an inexperience angler would if they were only using artificial baits.

In short, live bait fishing is MUCH easier.

WHY THE HELL DIDN'T SOMEONE TELL ME THIS SOONER!!!!!!!!!!

Jim Conlow Sr. · Post by **Jim Conlow Sr.** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 11:26 am

The companies that sponsor Bass tournaments do not sell live bait

kopper_bass · Post by **kopper_bass** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:31 pm

Jim and All,
I hear you guys, but saying that the only reason Bass tournaments dont use live bait is because the sponsors "dont sell it", or "they want to sell more tackle" doesnt hold up. All of the saltwater big game tournaments are sponsored by the same big names we are, and they allow live bait.

Look at FLW sponsored Kingfish Series or Walleye Series; they use live bait.

Just look at any saltwater tourney, they are sponsored by Mercury, BassPro, Yo-Zuri, etc. and almost every salt series uses live bait.

Come on guys, somebody has to have a legitimate reason why!

Kopper_Bass

kopper_bass · Post by **kopper_bass** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:39 pm

Tin Can,
Do you really think so? Do you really think its super simple to fish with live bait and not a matter of skill as well? you still gotta find fish that are feeding, present the bait in a reasonable manner, get them to bite, etc. How can that be so simple that its forbidden in a tourney?

I WILL PUT DOLLARS DOWN ON THIS!!!

Cooch vs. any takers, in a fishoff series on the delta, where Cooch uses only plastics and the challenger use live bait only!

Now i have money that says that over the course of the series Cooch would win more times than the live bait. Now Cooch may have an off day here or there, but i got money that says he would win more often than not. I actually believe that more than 50% of us everyday guys could actually beat the live bait fisherman.

Any takers????
What about it Cooch, let's have a friendly WesternBass challenge.

Kopper_Bass

kopper_bass · Post by **kopper_bass** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:42 pm

Cooch,
Do you think its just one of those rules that Ray originally created to make the challenge interesting and now nobody has ever looked to review or revise it?

Hmmm......Interesting!
Now that is so far the best possibility i have heard yet.

What about trolling Cooch? Looking at the other Series with FLW, they allow trolling for Walleye and Stripers, with or without live bait.

Why is trolling such a no-no?

Kopper_Bass

FISHorDIE · Post by **FISHorDIE** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:08 pm

lol, thats funny you should mention this kopper. I use to bait fish before I new what bass fishing was... now I catch more Bass with lures then with live bait back then.

One day I was fishing at eastmen lake catching fish not too far from some guys on the bank using Crawdads. I asked if they caught any nice fish and one replied... "the fish dont bite live bait anymore they only eat Senkos!"

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:23 pm

I donâ€™t know guys. I was at Lake Toho in Florida last year fishing with a guide. We threw artificial baits all morning for nothing. He asked me if I ever used shiners, told him no but Iâ€™ll try them. We proceeded to put a butt whipping on the Bass for the rest of the day. Made me a believer.

Scott L · Post by **Scott L** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:03 pm

Joe, I don't know why, but the live bait ban may have had to do with catch and release. Back then they felt using live bait meant gut hooked bass that you could not cull or release after weigh-in. I am not positive the first tourneys were c& r, but you could cull. At that time they also felt it was much more challenging to use lures and lures have come a long ways since then.

Another issue is that you cannot use the same types of live bait at every body of water.

The ban on trolling may have come from the same mindset of requiring less skills than other techniques. Look how quickly they put a rod length limit on flippin sticks.

It would be interesting to know the real factors at the time for the rules.

Scott

Andy Giannini · Post by **Andy Giannini** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:11 pm

Live bait is nature's Powerbait.

Nevermind scent, flavor, appearance, etc.

Stick a hook in it, (wounding the bait) and let it fight the float, current, sinker, and put out natural distress signals!

Forgot one thing, no school of bait, just one single bruised offering to avoid any confusion.

Live bait is great! Its not an unskilled fishing technique, there are some disadvantages, but also some perks.

I bought some minnows to take my boy fishing. He fished for a bit, caught em, got bored, and wanted to go home. Mom picked him up. I was left with all these minnows so I decided to fish them out.
Was it easy or a slam dunk? No, it took some fishing, but had been literally 15 years or more since I had done this. It was a blast. Still had to present things properly, but I had forgotten how much fun it could be.

I think just for good measure, a guy should fish with real baits once in awhile.

.02 A.G.

NaCl · Post by **NaCl** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:25 pm

Okay...here's the real reason...TRADITION! When competitive bass fishing first started it was a quest to see who could make his artificial bait act most like real prey. It was assumed that the catching-results were the ultimate proof of who was best at this new skill.

Early baits were nowhere near as sophisticated and "real" acting as what we have today so the theory was probably pretty accurate. Back then, they also didn't have sophisticated depth finders, powerful trolling motors or fast boats that could cover a lot of water...tools with which we better target fish today. The original "rules" were designed to showcase the fishermen's skills within the limitations of those times and they continue to drive tournament bass fishing over four decades later. Cooch hit the nail on the head...thank Ray Scott for starting this tradition.

So, the most obvious answer to this question is that the restriction to artificial baits is a long standing "tradition".

JMHO

.....NaCl