Cheating????

frank · Post by **frank** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:01 pm

Has anyone ever heard of an individual or team "banned for life" from a circuit for anything but cheating? If so, what for? I am not asking for names, just what other violations would warrant the ultimate punishment a tourney director can hand out.

Stratos278 · Post by **Stratos278** » Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:03 pm

Is this why you resurrected a thread from SEVEN years ago???? Couldn't you have just asked the question outright without bringing up a bunch of outdated, maybe even useless background?

DG · Post by DG » Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:15 pm

Being a TD for a small group, I am curious about the problem with making the names known in this case. First per the FPT, they say there was enough of a rules violation to cause the contestants to be DQ'd. They go on to say that after a "full investigation" so I have to believe that there was enough proof of the violation that the decision was made to DQ. With all that, how can there be fear of being sued for following the FPT's own rules and taking the appropriate action as spelled out. It would seem that there would be more chance of being sued for not doing what they did. As far as the names, why would they not show DQ and no points or weight in the standings??????? This is public record and every angler knows that their information is made public when they weigh in. For me I would not hesitate to include the DQ in my standings release and would also not be intimidated by the threat of legal action for "telling the truth"

I truly believe that most of us agree that the worst punishment for violating the rules and or cheating is when it's made public and the person/s involved have to face the rest of us who follow the rules and don't cheat! This is my opinion and I am not putting any group down especially the FPT.

Living in fear of legal action makes us the victim when we haven't done wrong but have "followed the rules" and done the thing!

Cooch · Post by **Cooch** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 9:27 am

DG wrote:I truly believe that most of us agree that the worst punishment for violating the rules and or cheating is when it's made public and the person/s involved have to face the rest of us who follow the rules and don't cheat! This is my opinion and I am not putting any group down especially the FPT.

Living in fear of legal action makes us the victim when we haven't done wrong but have "followed the rules" and done the thing!

I Agree with you DG 100%, unfortunately, there is the perverbial "BUT...." here. Our legal system, does not allow us, to not live in fear of the repercussions of our actions. It's wacky, a burglar breaks into your house, falls down the stairs and breaks a leg, your held liable. That kinda crap is BS! It doesn't end there, our laws, tend to sting us with this liability crap. It's my guess, as far as cheating in bass torunaments go, names are not pointedly exposed directly by the orgs, due to lawyers advising otherwise. It's an ugly, discusting deal for sure.

DG · Post by DG » Thu Sep 06, 2012 10:48 am

Cooch,
I understand what you are saying but in this case the team (if there was enough proof to DQ them) got zero points and no weight as could have been indicated
in the published standings. A simple DQ notation after their names instead of weight and points would have been all it takes. If there's liability for that then we all can sue the TD
and whomever because they publish our results! What happened was fact or they would not have been DQ'd. I don't think there's a judge even in California that would take
a case against a tournament organization as long as they followed their tournament rules and took the action provided in those rules. On the other hand, had they not done what they did, there
would have been grounds for lawsuits by those who were affected by the rules violators.

Remember the old deal where a convicted "rule violator" was put into a contraption with his/hers head and arms were clamped in a public place for everyone to see. The humiliation was the best form of punishment! Any carpenters out there?????

CN · Post by CN » Thu Sep 06, 2012 12:52 pm

Stratos278 wrote:Is this why you resurrected a thread from SEVEN years ago???? Couldn't you have just asked the question outright without bringing up a bunch of outdated, maybe even useless background?

Well it has become a little dull here otherwise you are correct..............why.

Revoke36 · Post by **Revoke36** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 3:28 pm

sTony wrote:Bob G it's like this....

Theif breaks into your home and starts loading up your stuff into a bag. On the way out he trips over your door jam and breaks his leg and then gets caught by the cops. Theif then turns around and sues you for not having maintained your door jam. In court you lose, regardless of the fact that the theif broke and entered your home.

See the court system doesn't always look at issues as black and white. And why should the FPT have to take on the financial responsibility. The ABA took huge lumps last year over an incident but the LA DA told them they wouldn't prosecute. Anglers were up in arms about what the ABA didn't do or say but their hands were tied.

I also said that these folks won't show up at other events. That should put it to rest.

sTony

"A homeowner does not owe a duty of care to a person illegally entering the house; therefore even if that person is injured by the homeowner's negligence, there is no liability because there was no duty of care"

Just curious; did Mike Hart sue WON Bass?

Cooch · Post by **Cooch** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:09 am

I'm with ya DG. Most orgs, just post the 0/0 and don't highlight the fact that someone got DQ'd. I'm not so sure posting the DQ serves any purpose really as it could be as simple as someone was late for weigh-in, blew a speed zone or some other infraction that was just a dumb mistake versus actually cheating to steal the winnings. Every DQ posted would start a witch hunt here on the internet. I do agree 100% though, that orgs who actually catch anglers in act of cheating with the intent of stealing the money, should be publically exposed every time, no disputes with that taking place.

@Revoke 36 - I don't believe he did, but if my recollection was correct on that particular instance, it wasn't WON who actually blew the initial whistle publically on him, yet they played the PC game and came in after the fact, to fully explain what took place and their position on the situation. It's been like this forever as best I know, the orgs have never been the first to speak out and publically expose those caught cheating. They play the PC came to cover their butts, and will continue to do so no matter what we think or want. It is what it is, in the end, we can only hope these guys indeed do get expose at some point in time.

Ceaser · Post by **Ceaser** » Fri Sep 07, 2012 10:56 am

bassgal wrote:Mike,
I never said that cheating was okay! NOT ONCE! However, don't be so quick to judge without knowing all of the facts. Besides, do you want to be known in the circuits as the one that likes to stir the pot? Like I said, just from what I have seen, if I knew that YOU were fishing a tournament, I would make damn sure that I wouldn't be there. God forbid that I look at you wrong, you might accuse me of cheating!

Yeah Mike! You big meany head! Gosh darn Delta rats!

wait... ill stir it for ya!

blkdog812 · Post by **blkdog812** » Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:06 pm

wonder if Vince or anyone from FPT has had the courtesy notified any of the other circuits/ tournament directors to let them the nature of the violation, just incase these guys decide to fish something else.