World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or ??

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Caudawg
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World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or ??

Post by Caudawg »

With all the giants (spots & LMB) being caught in northern CA these days...I'm just curious if there's been a change of heart as to where the next world record largemouth will be caught??

For years and years, it was thought by the majority that the next record would be caught in southern CA (again) due in part to the warmer average temperatures and longer "growing season" etc... Even fisheries biologists tended to agree that northern CA would not produce the next record LMB due to cooler average water temperatures (resulting in a lower metabolism) than those in Socal waters.

So, what do you guys think now? Where is the next world record LMB going to come from? And why?

My guess is Berryessa due to the above average trout and kokanee populations. Plus it has a very healthy population of threadfin, crayfish etc.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Larry Hemphill »

One could write an essay to answer your question - and it is a good question concerning largemouth! I will mention a few things and others can add their opinions. Two things come to mind - one is that NorCal waters are colder in the winter and for a longer period of time that S.Cal waters. That could change too with the warm winters we have been having! Growth is slower during the winters up here than down south - San Diego for example. Clear Lake has water in the 40's for about 3 month of the year, not much growth! I understand that down south, low water temps in the winter are in the 50's. Another issue is the trout, kokanee, and fresh water salmon plants. I have heard that most trout plants have stopped in S.Cal. That would slow the growth of giant bass that feed on these fish. Planted trout are usually given a growth hormone which help the bass grow a little faster too after these trout are eaten. I have heard that some of the southern trout plants may resume soon which again may help some bass regain their 20+ pound size. And there is the problem of tournament pressure in the spring. All the biggest bass caught are moved to a central location - often in the livewells of 50 to 100 bass boats - or more. They are weighed, put in release boats if available, and dumped somewhere off-shore. I have been told by many in the know that some of these big bass never do spawn - and down goes the gene pool. And - the biggest females are old and a few may not survive the stress of their day

I would have to agree with you that Berryessa seems to have an advantage for a possible record. It is only 400+ foot elevation and doesn't get quite as cold in the winter. However, when only a few 18 pounders have ever been caught in N.Cal (I think only 4), a world record doesn't seem very likely. That's the excitement of bass fishing, one never knows what the next cast will produce! Maybe some obscure slough in the delta?????

One final thought! We all saw the world record spotted bass being caught soon as they just seemed to be getting bigger and bigger - in several lakes - many in the 10 pound range. The possible world record from Bullards Bar is not really a shock - even as the current world record is now official as of last week at 10.48 lbs. A sudden world record largemouth in this country would be BIG news.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by x-pro fisherman »

I believe it could come out of a number of Nor Cal fisheries. Look at the huge weights coming out of a number of fisheries now. The only big lake fishing real small is Oroville, where a 2 lb fish is considered a big fish. Just about everywhere else 4-6 lb fish are common, and at clear lake and the delta 8-10 lb fish are a possibility every time you go out.

What is wrong with Oroville?
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Larry Hemphill »

Everything you said in your response is true. Especially Oroville (and Shasta) where spots simply over-breed and become stunted. Many 8 to 10 lb bass are caught every year at many bodies of water. How many over 13 lbs do you hear of? Another fellow and I each caught at 13 at Clear Lake within 2 weeks of each other, and that was pretty big news. And that was 1991 when the average bass there was much bigger. Anything bigger than 13 lbs is pretty big news except at New Melones, which is our newest major lake in N.Cal. The record there is around 17 1/2 lbs - I could be wrong - maybe one of the 18's was caught there. I think someone said that the same 17 1/2 pounder was caught after the spawn, and she went around 17-2. I was able to take some good photos of one of the last big bass caught at Clear Lake which went 15.38 lbs - caught in a tournament. That was special!! Those fish are extremely rare. So, in closing, it is obvious that those last near 4 pounds of weight needed for a record largemouth of 22 lbs 7 oz (weight needed to top the Japan bass of 22-5, would be a major catch that would attract worldwide attention!!! A world record needs to be 2 oz over a current record. All world records are in lbs/oz. That's why there is a "tie" now - 22-4 (Georgia), 22-5 (Japan). Would one of us like to be that person???? Stupid question!
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by DanIsaac »

All true, but what is really interesting is how our fisheries continue to produce despite what I personally see as outright abuse of said fisheries by our Fish & Wildlife services.

Whatever it takes to sell a permit, fine, sell em'. Little to no oversight that procedures are followed especially at the grass root levels of tournament fishing. Something like 130+ permits given out for Clear Lake last year, and that is just the beginning.

Over the past year or so there have been several nationally published reports on studies done on lakes where most, or all events utilize one region of a specific body of water. The numbers are distressing at best. The mortality rate goes up to something like 47% after release, mainly the fish from deeper waters. Apparently they do not adjust or move back as readily as most think, especially in warmer weather. It has now been proven that the continued practice(s) have a disastrous effect on a fishery, especially in instances where the shallow end of the lake(s) played host to said events. Sound familiar?

Unfortunately I do not believe California will produce the next record. It certainly could if our resources were managed in a way to maximize certain fisheries' potential. However, I believe are fisheries are merely seen as a source of revenue, and never for their true potential.

My .02

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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Larry Hemphill »

All bass anglers should read your post - well said!!
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by M3AN Bass »

What bout El Salto in Mexico? That'd be my guess.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Robb R »

what a great topic/post . I agree with everything said . The sad part is we are our own worst enemy when it comes to protecting bass . Very little known about what we can prove happens to catch and release bass , especially in tournament formats . I like watching MLF , they catch , weigh and release quickly . I am certain that is less stressful to the bass , especially the big girls .
I fish a small local reservoir , Calero , 4000 surface acres . all the time . I have caught and released over a dozen 10lb + bass the last several years . I think the lake record is over 14lbs and my PB is 12.4 lb . Why is a very small local lake so productive ----NO TOURNAMENTS and most of the bass guys release them .
I do think a record can come from a lake like Amador . Why ? They stocked Florida strain bass over 40 years ago . They stock trout every year and in huge quantities . The Lake record at Amador is over 17 lbs and that was 25 years ago . The bass in Amador have toooo much food and I would bet there are a few giant Florida strain bass in there eating like kings and they have NO reason to chase lures . It's a deep Lake , tons of structure , tons on cover , very little tournament pressure and the bass can easily avoid fisherman.
The only bad part , it will most likely come from somebody soaking minnows with a surf rod going after crappie using 40lb mono ----pure dumb luck
tight lines ,
Robb
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by DeltaBassBuster »

My vote is for the Delta!! :wink:
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by clearlakeoutdoors »

Heres my thoughts on this. Clearlakes record (17.5) hasnt been broken in 25 years.There hasnt been any Florida strain bass put in since the 80s. I might be wrong but i dont think the bass in Clearlake are pure Florida bass anymore they have cross bred with the northerns and just dont have the genes to get that big anymore.Bass live 15-20 years at most.
Berryessa has a chance . It has been stocked with Floridas every year and it has trout.
The Lakes down in southern ca. have a longer warm water season and i think that is where the record will come from.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by ash »

next world record will be a farm raised fish in Texas or MX - the private pond owners doing Play to pay have the benefit of directly managing the eco system. Its nice to dream about a World Record but the LMB fisheries in NorCal have lots of big fish that love to eat trout and have an abundance of food but i think its unlikely the next World Record to come from this state - if it does it will be served on a plate in a back room
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by elfish16 »

M3AN Bass wrote:What bout El Salto in Mexico? That'd be my guess.
that's a fun thought but I highly doubt it will happen there. So Cal was in the running hands down until the trout plants were taken away from us. I've seen lakes single handily destroyed by lack of plants... it's sad. Remember when Casitas was going to post the new WR??? Now days it's lucky to post a single DD. Lakes cycle and bigger fish die off as well. Mission Viejo was wiped clean by the algae. I hate to say it, but CA may produce it and if it does I couldn't tell you where. Sadly, as we are going now, So Cal wont be producing a record.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Wolfeman »

Falcon Lake. The Texas Big Bass program is going to create that monster.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Oldschool »

Let's get real, Norcal will own the world record Spotted bass and it's been broken twice in within 2 years.
The hay days of SoCal are gone and unless a lots of things change, including the weather.
I have 5 LMB between 17.4 and 19.3 lbs, 2 that exceed northern Cal and Texas records and none are note worthy in the realm of giant bass over 20 lbs. One reason it's extremely difficult to authenicate any bass that is released alive, unless it's caught during a sanctioned tournament with certified scale and a biologist to examine the bass. A new world record largemouth must be put on ice.
If SoCal goes back to planting hatchery raised trout and the weather changes so the lakes fill to maximum pool levels, it may be possible for Socal to have a slim chance at a 22.5+ lb LMB, hope I live to see it!
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Steve »

NorCal will never produce a world record bass. I could write a book about the reasons why. Its pretty cut and dry.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Chris N »

Who knows? Like Elfish mentioned, LMV took a major hit with the golden algae, that place was unique- seems like the lack of water fluctuation and the proper forage along with perfect genetics made that place kick out giants for years without the cycles that hit most trophy fisheries (and no derbies, like others mentioned). It's a huge difference for a lake to produce a fish of a lifetime that weighs 18 to go all the way up to 20+. Can an 18 pounder in NorCal live long enough and gain enough weight to hit 20, much less 22? Seems like commercial fishing and water levels kind of dooms Mexico.., Maybe Japan can kick out another one? Sucks to see Castaic and Casitas an afterthought in the race.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Chris N »

I do like reading the stories out of Cuba, even as a kid in the 70's or early 80's reading Field and Stream, they told some tall tales- great reading but is it or was it real?
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Steve »

The golden algae kill off at LMV is probably the best thing that ever happened to that lake. It may instigate a major growth spurt in what had become a stagnant growth scenario for that lake. With the consistent trout stockings, we may see that lake come back on fire in a number of years. How many years, 3 maybe 8, who knows.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Chris N »

Don't know if it's the best thing ever, sounds like a few fish survived which is great- I think genes play a big part of it and there's no way to re-stock that...
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Trout plants

Post by Larry Hemphill »

I'm sure this thread is probably over, but I just wanted to mention another fact. Trout plants aren't what they used to be. Many lakes are raising their own trout which are bigger than the usual DFW plants. Robb mentioned Amador plants. Few bass could eat those - many are 4 to 10 lbs - and bigger!! I talked to the guy planting trout at Collins Lake last week. He said some were 1 to 2 lbs, but most were 3 to 6 lbs. Tough to get you mouth around those!
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Oldschool »

Trout plants are helpful, not essential. Lake Hodges produced a 20.4 lb bass* with no trout as forage.
FLMB live about 15 years, the first 3 years are critical to growth potential, the last 2 years are past their growing age, they lose weight and die. We are talking about bass in the 12-13 year age group.
Low water pools create a condition where very low recruitment occurs, the fry and young bass have no place to hide and little feed on.
Heavy rains following low pool level creates a new lake ecosystem, new cover with good growth potentail for the young bass, that is what happened at Hodges in the 70's for example and Casitas in the late 80's. Add trout plants and you have the ideal prey source for the big adults, doesn't help the young adult size bass.
Pray for a lot of rain in SoCal.
Tom
* pure Florida strain, no NLMB population in Hodges at that time.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Robb R »

OLdschool ---how friggin awesome that you've had that success----probably less than 5 people in the world can make that claim ---- you should create a post on how you caught em !!!
Larry H , would love to meet you and talk Amador , I started fishing that Lake in the 70's , it's the Lake that really started my Bass fishing passion--. I still think that Lake has a great shot at a record . It's deep , tons of food ( including those huge trout ) tons of cover and structure . The main problem with fishing Amador is the food competition ---- the bass have tons of food options.
As for the DFG (now called Fish and Wildlife ) , they have turned into a Policing agency . They spend way to much time and money ( our money ) chasing illegals that meat fish and grow weed and less time managing fisheries . I know this because a young man I coached in baseball for years has been a game Warden up in Northern Calif (up by the Oregon border ) and now in Los Banos . He tells some stories that are crazy.
As for growth rates , Florida and Northern strain has different life expectancies , in the south with the longer growing season , they both tend to live shorter lives , further north , they live longer and but grow slower . I am sure some between both will produce the giants.
Tight lines ,
Robb
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Tony P »

[quote="ash"]next world record will be a farm raised fish in Texas or MX - the private pond owners doing Play to pay have the benefit of directly managing the eco system. Its nice to dream about a World Record but the LMB fisheries in NorCal have lots of big fish that love to eat trout and have an abundance of food but i think its unlikely the next World Record to come from this state - if it does it will be served on a plate in a back room[/quote]

I agree 100%. A Texas Doctor is trying to grow the world record in private ponds & special freshwater prawns as feed. As far as I'm concerned it's no different then supplementing White Tail Deer to grow larger antlers. Here's the article from B.A.S.S. http://www.bassmaster.com/tips/building ... ecord-bass.

Also before everyone starts getting bent out of shape saying California is basically doing the same thing by planting Trout & Kokanee in our lakes lets look at a couple facts. The lakes that California plant are public reservoirs (for the most part) not private lakes & the Trout & Kokanee weren't planted a forage for Bass. Now if you listen to KB on Ultimate bass you might think differently about the last statement :wink:. So let's all support the California Inland Fisheries Foundation so the keep planting those tasty silver snacks for our bass so we can grab the world record before Texas does. Here's link so join today, http://www.ciffi.org/.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Ceaser »

Paul Duclos, Spring Lake, Santa Rosa.. World record class fish 1997 I believe. 24lbs..ish.
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Re: World record bass. Will it come from Norcal or Socal or

Post by Oldschool »

IF California had a good fishery management program like Texas Share a Lunker, we would have already broken the world record for LMB. All CA does is release random wild FLMB fingerlings and yearlings into variuos lakes and those bass are on their own.
Spring lake produced 2 giant bass or maybe the same bass caught twice, the bass was never weighed on a certified scale, measured or officially examined and we will never know what the bass actually weighed.
For giant female bass to locate and spawn with the biggest male in the lake to produce a generation of more giant bass, the odds are staggering. If big males and females don't spawn together the population may crash, just another factor to consider along with everything else. If CA had hatchery raised FLMB using the best availble genetics like Share a Lunker does with selective genes before releasing the fish, we would have a more stable population of giant bass and be able to validate them.
Tom
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