Bass Fishing Forum - Westernbass.com

As a fisheries biologist, I usually think about technological fishing advances from the perspective of whether they could increase the chances of overharvest. Technology is rapidly changing in all types of fisheries, both recreational (freshwater and saltwater) and commercial. This technology has great potential for improving various aspects of the sport, like individual angler catch rates, potential to catch trophy fish and for anglers to learn more about fish behavior and seasonal movements. Technology is not a bad thing, but it is a factor that needs to be considered in fisheries management.

In fisheries science, we have a term called “catchability” which applies to specific fishing equipment. This is defined as the fraction of a fish population captured per unit of fishing effort. In commercial fisheries, this could be the fraction of a fish population caught per trawl or per gill net set. In recreational fisheries, it could be the number of fish caught per angling day. Improvements in technology can increase catchability, such that more fish are caught per unit of fishing effort.

Read it all: https://www.bassmaster.com/conservation ... ing-sonar/

Be interested in a DFW biologist view point on bass fishery management.
Tom

Tom POV would only be that persons perspective. The article indicates that fishery biologists are studying the effects it may have to overfishing. The issue is that once the biologist publish their findings is that there will already be a significant impact. The other issue is that I would imagine that the study is for a variety of fresh water fish and not just bass specific.

I don't think CA DFW gives two shakes about the health of our bass fisheries. If anything, a decline would help the state by removing bass fishermen from voting against them.

In my opinion FFS has no impact on fisheries. What it does impact is a young angler’s learning curve and being able to compete with older, more experienced anglers than they could without FFS

As a DFW reservoir biologist for the last 16 years and an avid bass angler for over 30 years I agree with everything the author of the article says 100%.

The DFW or DFG back a few years ago policy was plant Black Bass species 1 time and let them self propagate for eternity. The one exception occurred when local lakes requested Florida Strain bass be introduced into this specific reservoirs in the 70’s.Over 50 year with the initial introduction of FLMB in SoCal lakes, the vigor has almost vanished. Why not take a page from Texas and raise FLMB strains and plant them annually? FFS would be a mute conversation with a stable populations big bass.
My generation had the advantage of Orville Balls experiment stocking FLMB in San Diego and later into Castiac and Casitas creating world famous bass fisheries. Why not continue and let another generation of bass anglers achieve the goal of catching a bass of their lifetime? It’s not technology that is a concern it’s fishery management of lack thereof!
Tom

WRB your 100% correct on this thread.

[quote=WRB post_id=689257 time=1718158738 user_id=35944]
The DFW or DFG back a few years ago policy was plant Black Bass species 1 time and let them self propagate for eternity. The one exception occurred when local lakes requested Florida Strain bass be introduced into this specific reservoirs in the 70’s.Over 50 year with the initial introduction of FLMB in SoCal lakes, the vigor has almost vanished. Why not take a page from Texas and raise FLMB strains and plant them annually? FFS would be a mute conversation with a stable populations big bass.
My generation had the advantage of Orville Balls experiment stocking FLMB in San Diego and later into Castiac and Casitas creating world famous bass fisheries. Why not continue and let another generation of bass anglers achieve the goal of catching a bass of their lifetime? It’s not technology that is a concern it’s fishery management of lack thereof!
Tom
[/quote]

Because it doesn't work.

The lack of fisheries management is from anglers not doing their part and harvesting fish. All fisheries management is predicated upon harvest. Size limits. bag limits, seasons. quotas, limited entry are all the tools in the bag used to manage a fishery. Voluntarily releasing nearly all of the fish caught is why we are where we are.

Lusk et al. 2023 found the following...
[attachment=0]Capture.JPG[/attachment]

I agree C& R is over board with bass anglers that fish derbies but the weekend anglers and general public catch and eat most the fish they catch. As long as fishery has a sustainable bass population no DFW management is needed in the eye of a biologist.
As a bass angler catching a limit of 2 lb bass with occasional 3 lb bass the fishery sucks. Bass anglers are hoping to catch a fish of their lifetime or a DD occasionally. We had those fisheries when FLMB were introduced in both SoCal and NorCal reservoirs plus the Delta.
To make my point in Feb 1971 I caught my PB NLMB 12 1/4 lbs on jig. In 1981 or 10 yours later fishing Casitas I caught a 18 lb 11 oz FLMB at the same location and month on a jig. Casitas ecosystem didn’t change same forage base. What changed was Florida LMB were introduced. That same year 2 months later 1981 Ray Easley would catch a 21 lb 3 oz FLMB. Without Pure Florida strain LMB Casitas wouldn’t become a world class bass fishery it became, same with Castiac. Castiac has ecosystem issue with Stripe Bass dominating the prey sources, Casitas doesn’t.
Real life experiences counter statistics.
Peace,
Tom

Kwin wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:16 am
Because it doesn't work.

The lack of fisheries management is from anglers not doing their part and harvesting fish. All fisheries management is predicated upon harvest. Size limits. bag limits, seasons. quotas, limited entry are all the tools in the bag used to manage a fishery. Voluntarily releasing nearly all of the fish caught is why we are where we are.

Lusk et al. 2023 found the following...
Capture.JPG

The California Delta had a THRIVING population of Florida that was healthy and vibrant for generations throughout the fishery. Between the increased salinity and predation from resident colonies of sea lions, the F1 Floridas are a thing of the past. The genetics have been diluted between northern strain , and it is now uncommon to see a fish over 10 come to the scales whereas 8yrs ago, my best 5 fish went for 40 lbs, with two of those being double-digit fish. The lack of care or management for bass fishing by CA DFW is apparent throughout the state. The state has all but deemed bass as invasive species and bass anglers as a political barrier for water conveyancy rights. The Texas Lunker program is a success because Texas invests resources and pride in delivering a trophy fishery.

ash wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 1:23 pm

Kwin wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:16 am
Because it doesn't work.

The lack of fisheries management is from anglers not doing their part and harvesting fish. All fisheries management is predicated upon harvest. Size limits. bag limits, seasons. quotas, limited entry are all the tools in the bag used to manage a fishery. Voluntarily releasing nearly all of the fish caught is why we are where we are.

Lusk et al. 2023 found the following...
Capture.JPG

The California Delta had a THRIVING population of Florida that was healthy and vibrant for generations throughout the fishery. Between the increased salinity and predation from resident colonies of sea lions, the F1 Floridas are a thing of the past. The genetics have been diluted between northern strain , and it is now uncommon to see a fish over 10 come to the scales whereas 8yrs ago, my best 5 fish went for 40 lbs, with two of those being double-digit fish. The lack of care or management for bass fishing by CA DFW is apparent throughout the state. The state has all but deemed bass as invasive species and bass anglers as a political barrier for water conveyancy rights. The Texas Lunker program is a success because Texas invests resources and pride in delivering a trophy fishery.

Don't forget the herbicides the State has been spraying, so big fish have nowhere to hide from sealions. The spawn is a sealion buffet.

WRB wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 1:00 pm I agree C& R is over board with bass anglers that fish derbies but the weekend anglers and general public catch and eat most the fish they catch. As long as fishery has a sustainable bass population no DFW management is needed in the eye of a biologist.
As a bass angler catching a limit of 2 lb bass with occasional 3 lb bass the fishery sucks. Bass anglers are hoping to catch a fish of their lifetime or a DD occasionally. We had those fisheries when FLMB were introduced in both SoCal and NorCal reservoirs plus the Delta.
To make my point in Feb 1971 I caught my PB NLMB 12 1/4 lbs on jig. In 1981 or 10 yours later fishing Casitas I caught a 18 lb 11 oz FLMB at the same location and month on a jig. Casitas ecosystem didn’t change same forage base. What changed was Florida LMB were introduced. That same year 2 months later 1981 Ray Easley would catch a 21 lb 3 oz FLMB. Without Pure Florida strain LMB Casitas wouldn’t become a world class bass fishery it became, same with Castiac. Castiac has ecosystem issue with Stripe Bass dominating the prey sources, Casitas doesn’t.
Real life experiences counter statistics.
Peace,
Tom

I disagree that most weekend anglers keep their catch. I’m a weekend angler and haven’t eaten a bass in 20 years. With that said I don’t judge those who keep an occasional fish or two for dinner. Just don’t give fish away to neighbors and/or freeze fish.

monte300 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 14, 2024 6:35 am

WRB wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 1:00 pm I agree C& R is over board with bass anglers that fish derbies but the weekend anglers and general public catch and eat most the fish they catch. As long as fishery has a sustainable bass population no DFW management is needed in the eye of a biologist.
As a bass angler catching a limit of 2 lb bass with occasional 3 lb bass the fishery sucks. Bass anglers are hoping to catch a fish of their lifetime or a DD occasionally. We had those fisheries when FLMB were introduced in both SoCal and NorCal reservoirs plus the Delta.
To make my point in Feb 1971 I caught my PB NLMB 12 1/4 lbs on jig. In 1981 or 10 yours later fishing Casitas I caught a 18 lb 11 oz FLMB at the same location and month on a jig. Casitas ecosystem didn’t change same forage base. What changed was Florida LMB were introduced. That same year 2 months later 1981 Ray Easley would catch a 21 lb 3 oz FLMB. Without Pure Florida strain LMB Casitas wouldn’t become a world class bass fishery it became, same with Castiac. Castiac has ecosystem issue with Stripe Bass dominating the prey sources, Casitas doesn’t.
Real life experiences counter statistics.
Peace,
Tom

I disagree that most weekend anglers keep their catch. I’m a weekend angler and haven’t eaten a bass in 20 years. With that said I don’t judge those who keep an occasional fish or two for dinner. Just don’t give fish away to neighbors and/or freeze fish.

Most weekend anglers are multi species fishermen, Bass anglers like you are targeting 1 species.
What the biologists is saying they manage lake with bass to be self sustainable as long as anglers release all the bass they catch there isn’t a reason to restock Florida strain.
No need for FFS to catch 1 3/4 to 2 1/2 lb sustainable bass!
Tom

WRB wrote: ↑Fri Jun 14, 2024 7:20 am

monte300 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 14, 2024 6:35 am

WRB wrote: ↑Thu Jun 13, 2024 1:00 pm I agree C& R is over board with bass anglers that fish derbies but the weekend anglers and general public catch and eat most the fish they catch. As long as fishery has a sustainable bass population no DFW management is needed in the eye of a biologist.
As a bass angler catching a limit of 2 lb bass with occasional 3 lb bass the fishery sucks. Bass anglers are hoping to catch a fish of their lifetime or a DD occasionally. We had those fisheries when FLMB were introduced in both SoCal and NorCal reservoirs plus the Delta.
To make my point in Feb 1971 I caught my PB NLMB 12 1/4 lbs on jig. In 1981 or 10 yours later fishing Casitas I caught a 18 lb 11 oz FLMB at the same location and month on a jig. Casitas ecosystem didn’t change same forage base. What changed was Florida LMB were introduced. That same year 2 months later 1981 Ray Easley would catch a 21 lb 3 oz FLMB. Without Pure Florida strain LMB Casitas wouldn’t become a world class bass fishery it became, same with Castiac. Castiac has ecosystem issue with Stripe Bass dominating the prey sources, Casitas doesn’t.
Real life experiences counter statistics.
Peace,
Tom

I disagree that most weekend anglers keep their catch. I’m a weekend angler and haven’t eaten a bass in 20 years. With that said I don’t judge those who keep an occasional fish or two for dinner. Just don’t give fish away to neighbors and/or freeze fish.

Most weekend anglers are multi species fishermen, Bass anglers like you are targeting 1 species.
What the biologists is saying they manage lake with bass to be self sustainable as long as anglers release all the bass they catch there isn’t a reason to restock Florida strain.
No need for FFS to catch 1 3/4 to 2 1/2 lb sustainable bass!
Tom

Good point, Tom. I’m a retired bass angler that avoids being on the water on the weekends at all cost!

I have angler survey data from the last 5-15 years that says nearly all anglers that catch a legal sized bass at San V, El Cap, DVL, Skinner, Lower Otay, Perris and Hodges voluntarily throw 95-99% of them back. Up to 80% of other harvestable species will be taken, bass will not be taken.

Genetics are an irrelevant variable if there is too much competition for calories.

Kwin wrote: ↑Thu Aug 22, 2024 2:33 pm I have angler survey data from the last 5-15 years that says nearly all anglers that catch a legal sized bass at San V, El Cap, DVL, Skinner, Lower Otay, Perris and Hodges voluntarily throw 95-99% of them back. Up to 80% of other harvestable species will be taken, bass will not be taken.

Genetics are an irrelevant variable if there is too much competition for calories.

If Skinner and DVL are anything like Silverwood, stripers are much more of an issue than largemouth.