Interesting Tournament Trail Format Forming

tunaman · Post by **tunaman** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 9:34 pm

This was posted on CalBassin, and must have been the special tournament that Gary Dobbins eluded to in a previous post:
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[quote]For Immediate Release

December 9, 2009 - Greenbrae, CA â€“ Cal Bass Champs in association with Dobyns Rods announced a new California State Championship tournament circuit. In addition to fishing for the title of California State Champion, anglers will fish for a first place prize of $20,000 and over $80,000 cash*. Entry fees for this event are $118 at the local stage and free at the regional and state championship events.
"This is an entirely new concept in bass fishing tournaments", stated Gary Dobyns the winningest angler in California 's history. "Creating a more reasonably priced tournament circuit not only enables more anglers to enter but gives anglers, that might not otherwise get the chance, to fish for big cash prizes.â€

tunaman · Post by **tunaman** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 9:36 pm

More preliminary info for the event:
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Event dates, sign up dates and more to come early next week!

But the lakes will most likely look like this

Local #1 â€“ Lake Havasu
Local #2 â€“ Diamond Valley
Local #3 â€“ Lower Otay
Local #4 â€“ Lake Perris

Regional Qualifier
El Capitan

Region 2
Local #5 â€“ Lake Castaic
Local #6 â€“ Lake Pyramid
Local #7 â€“ Lake Cachuma
Local #8 â€“ Nacimiento

Regional Qualifier
Isabella

Region 3
Local #9 â€“ Don Pedro
Local #10 â€“ Delta
Local #11 â€“ New Melones
Local #12 â€“ McClure

Regional Qualifier
Camanche

Region 4
Local #13 â€“ Oroville
Local #14 â€“ Clear Lake
Local #15 â€“ Berryessa
Local #16 â€“ Shasta

Regional Qualifier
Folsom

Championship for Year 1
Clear Lake

DAN360V · Post by **DAN360V** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:05 pm

I think this is great! Ive been waiting for a series like this! Im in for sure. cant wait to hear more detils! Those would be some awsome bragging rights, and great exposure for the anglers.

Dan Wells

tunaman · Post by **tunaman** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:09 pm

Don't care so much about the exposure aspect or bragging rights, but am certainly intrigued with the one-on-one aspect.

Can't wait to see what Gary has to chime in on this, as it sounds like he's got a significant hand in its development.

Roger

492slayer · Post by **492slayer** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:23 pm

Sounded good until it states only Pro's and no amatuers. The format is very progressive, but if you are a working man and don't have the abilities to fish as a pro, your SOL? I mean $118 is one heck of a bargain. At that rate I could easily compete on any of the lakes (Oroville, Berryessa, Shasta...). Let's wait and see how things shape up

DAN360V · Post by **DAN360V** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:25 pm

I like the one on one aspect also. No excuse's, win alone or lose alone! Pretty cool. The V.T.O/Camera man simular to the HBC could be neat, it could prevent any thought of cheaters competing, add exposure and im sure be some awsome/helpful footage! Either way I think this format will be sucsessful and fun! Great job to everyone involved in devolping this.

Dan Wells

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:42 pm

If you have a bassboat and $118..00 and you are one of the first 50 to sign up in each of the regions you can fish is this correct.

RichThiel · Post by **RichThiel** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:24 pm

Gary Dobyns · Post by **Gary Dobyns** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:31 pm

This is a new idea. It's pretty cheap. 200 time your entry to the winner. 40 guys make almost 10 times their entry. Great bragging rights. This idea has bounced around for a couple of weeks. This afternoon, this is where it landed. Anyone can fish as long as they have a boat and $118. Great bragging rights and should be a lot of fun. I personally believe the FUN factor has been missing in a lot of events. I think this should be a fun event with LOTS of trash talking. Make the top 10 on your home water and advance. More news to follow. I am in on this. I think it will be very successful. There will not be conflicts and I will still support other orgs and am still hoping to stay on advisory committees. There are a couple of Pro-am circuits with GREAT schedules, I will be at many of these events. This is not designed to compete against other orgs. My thoughts. Let's have some fun!!

492slayer · Post by **492slayer** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:46 pm

Well if Gary says anyone can compete, I'm looking to show what I can do...

sTony · Post by **sTony** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:15 am

Gary Dobyns wrote: This is not designed to compete against other orgs.

How is it not? As long as there are event permits being pulled it's competing, even if only for dates. But that would seem to be the biggest already existing problem we have. And the plan is five dates times four regions and championship. Where do the dates come from that make this a non-competitor to everything else already out there?

I know what I'm writing won't be popular but this is the type of deal that'll likely do only so well itself and at the same time further cripple the previously existing Pro-Am and Team concepts who are already searching to find dates that don't conflict. This just adds to that strain. It's just one more org out there to add to the pile and split anglers even further.

The way I see it a guy has to fish four events that pay next to nothing back to qualify to fish another event that doesn't pay much back to qualify and fish for a championship that does finally pay something back. And travel all over the 'region' to do it as only your region 3 has all lakes in relatively close proximity.

And, for the record, anglers have been competing for the 'California State Championship' by competing in the FLW/TBF Federation or Federation Nation tournaments where the end goal is to make the State Team and Regionals and hopefully move on to either the Bassmaster Classic or the FLW Championship.

The Fed guys have only been doing this for decades. The current 'California State Champion' from TBF is Cameron Smith, btw.

I'm not 'getting it' and see a lot more expense to this thing then it would appear to be worth. But hey, y'all have fun fishin' it!

sTony

Phil · Post by **Phil** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:49 am

ABSOULTLY MARVALOUS !

Finally an economacially affordable tournament a retired guy or and upcoming young pro can afford to fish and afford the gas to fish ! All you're going to need is Valet launching and parking.
Thank you Gary & staff.
I'm in !

Schneider Fishing · Post by **Schneider Fishing** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 5:27 am

Sounds good to me!!
Now I just need the right dates.

bryanmc · Post by **bryanmc** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:03 am

sTony... It's not competing, it's a whole different format (and probably one that will be very well received). Not team, not a pro-am, just a straight up pro on pro event. Sure, they'll need permits, but who decided that only those who currently apply can apply in the future. Given the disregard for scheduling on top of other organizations we have seen this year, who cares?

I don't see it as being expensive at all. You have a one in 5 chance of making the regionals at the first tournament. If you have to fish all four, you're still in less than $500. After you qualify for the regionals (which have no entry fee) you have a one in 4 chance of going to the finals (which have no entry fee.)

Sounds like an awesome concept to me. I'm in!

DL · Post by DL » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:23 am

You guys do realize that you get nothing unless you qualify for the Championship, right?

I may have read it wrong, but thats how I interpret the format....

Johnny C · Post by **Johnny C** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:25 am

I like the idea. After the third event 30 of the top guys in a region won't even be fishing (ooops isn't that why so many fish rookie leagues). This is an excellent idea that cost little money, time and expense. May come out of tournamnet retirement for this one.

2ndsuks · Post by **2ndsuks** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:35 am

DL wrote:You guys do realize that you get nothing unless you qualify for the Championship, right?

I may have read it wrong, but thats how I interpret the format....

If you make a top ten at your regional (2nd event) you get $1,000.

But just like the FLW and all tournaments, it is possible to fish 2 days and get nothing.

BMX Bassin · Post by **BMX Bassin** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:42 am

sTony wrote:
Gary Dobyns wrote: This is not designed to compete against other orgs.
How is it not? As long as there are event permits being pulled it's competing, even if only for dates. But that would seem to be the biggest already existing problem we have. And the plan is five dates times four regions and championship. Where do the dates come from that make this a non-competitor to everything else already out there?

I know what I'm writing won't be popular but this is the type of deal that'll likely do only so well itself and at the same time further cripple the previously existing Pro-Am and Team concepts who are already searching to find dates that don't conflict. This just adds to that strain. It's just one more org out there to add to the pile and split anglers even further.

The way I see it a guy has to fish four events that pay next to nothing back to qualify to fish another event that doesn't pay much back to qualify and fish for a championship that does finally pay something back. And travel all over the 'region' to do it as only your region 3 has all lakes in relatively close proximity.

And, for the record, anglers have been competing for the 'California State Championship' by competing in the FLW/TBF Federation or Federation Nation tournaments where the end goal is to make the State Team and Regionals and hopefully move on to either the Bassmaster Classic or the FLW Championship.

The Fed guys have only been doing this for decades. The current 'California State Champion' from TBF is Cameron Smith, btw.

I'm not 'getting it' and see a lot more expense to this thing then it would appear to be worth. But hey, y'all have fun fishin' it!

sTony

Pretty negative. If this was somebody elses idea I think the opinion would be all for it but because he and the event cordinator .... dont see eye to eye there it is. But this is an opinion based forum and we all have our opinions, just as I am expressing mine.

but in all positive I think this tournament series, FLW Guard and AC Pro Ams will be the ticket for competive juices this year.

Phil · Post by **Phil** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 6:45 am

2ndsuks wrote:
DL wrote:You guys do realize that you get nothing unless you qualify for the Championship, right?

I may have read it wrong, but thats how I interpret the format....
If you make a top ten at your regional (2nd event) you get $1,000.

But just like the FLW and all tournaments, it is possible to fish 2 days and get nothing.

The way I read it. You finish 1st in a division tournament you get $ 1000, you qualify for championship, you get $ 1000. Seems pretty clear to me. Plus you get to fish alone, in your own boat. No chance of drawing a nerd ! Win loose or draw, it's all on you. How many guys now fish pro-ams, teams, and get nothing.
It is a great idea even with the coming nevative comments.
Also is Tom really banned from this site ? Rumors ?

Brian D. · Post by **Brian D.** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:06 am

DL - top 10 in the regional = $1000

Question: So, if i qualify for a regional and dont make the cut, can I travel and fish another region's regional?

DL · Post by DL » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:07 am

Phil wrote:
2ndsuks wrote:
DL wrote:You guys do realize that you get nothing unless you qualify for the Championship, right?

I may have read it wrong, but thats how I interpret the format....
If you make a top ten at your regional (2nd event) you get $1,000.

But just like the FLW and all tournaments, it is possible to fish 2 days and get nothing.
The way I read it. You finish 1st in a division tournament you get $ 1000, you qualify for championship, you get $ 1000. Seems pretty clear to me. Plus you get to fish alone, in your own boat. No chance of drawing a nerd ! Win loose or draw, it's all on you. How many guys now fish pro-ams, teams, and get nothing.
It is a great idea even with the coming nevative comments.
Also is Tom really banned from this site ? Rumors ?

I'm not bashing the format, I just read it a few times and drew my conclusions and pointed something out. I've fished many a format and got nothing, this would fit right into my MO since 07'

DL · Post by DL » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:11 am

Brian D. wrote:DL - top 10 in the regional = $1000

Question: So, if i qualify for a regional and dont make the cut, can I travel and fish another region's regional?

I got that part of...I know you have to qualify for the TOC to get the $1000... You have to advance through two rounds before you get paid...which I dont have a problem with.

2ndsuks · Post by **2ndsuks** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:21 am

Brian D. wrote: Question: So, if i qualify for a regional and dont make the cut, can I travel and fish another region's regional?

"Anglerâ€™s cannot qualify more than 1 time for the regional events and they may not qualify in more than 1 region."

Ricky-S · Post by **Ricky-S** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:21 am

Looks VERY interesting. Of course the dates will make or break any organization.

Looks like a great way to get some anglers out on the water.

This year will make or break a lot of organizations and any new business is going to take a lot of work and courage.

Business is WAR and lets not forget that.

Looks like some people have already drawn lines in the sand....

I wish Tom and this idea all the best because most, if not all, of us really want the same thing: affordable, FUN events, with great paybacks and HUGE Participation.

Gary Dobyns · Post by **Gary Dobyns** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:21 am

Wow Tony. I hope you got some rest and woke up in a better mood

There will not be date conflicts. This is something that was the biggest obstacle. The events will be on Fridays. Please bear with me guys. We don't want to go head to head with other orgs. Dates are always such a bitc* to work around. I know guys have to work, but for a small entry on your home lake and a shot at $20000, I think many will use a vacation day.

You do not have to fish a whole region (you can if your not qualified) Many guys will simply fish THEIR lake. Some guys that don't make the top 10 would try again on another body of water. This is a pretty simple, fairly cheap format and you don't have a bunch of events to fish.

The other thing, we just might draw some guys that don't fish tournaments or some that used to be. Guys I know of some "unknown" anglers that don't compete anymore that can flat catch them as good as anyone.

We do still have a few things to work out. We are asking advise from fisherman and will listen. I have quite a bit of knowledge on tournaments and bodies of water (in the north) I don't know crap about MOST of the lakes South or central. But I know many guys that do. I simply will ask and listen. This in itself is a fairly new concept.

Let's have some fun.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:49 am

I think this is a very good tournament format thats coming out and tony if those other orgs are having trouble with getting angler too come fish there tournaments and the conflicts between them they may need to just move on or die out. Today anglers are looking to go out and fish without conflict its funny to set back and watch tournament orgs butt head over date because the owners of those orgs dont get alone with each other. Maybe the other orgs better take a good look at this format. Isee in this new format there room for sponsors and i got a pm from one of the guy that help put it together and sponsoring that tournament is reasonable fromn the pm i got. I think this new format of fishing for a state championship is going to do very well i know some really anglers here in the central valley that will fish the motherlode region without a doubt. GARY + 1 And to all the other orgs you better start working harder TO KEEP THE ANGLERS YOUVE GOT.

Robert Ratzlaff · Post by **Robert Ratzlaff** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:29 am

May come out of tournamnet retirement for this one.

Johnny C · Post by **Johnny C** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:30 am

Gary after giving this some thought I think you and Tom are under estimating this thing. Heck it would only take 200 guys to fill up each region. I think there is even a more fair way to do this and get more envolved. That is if you fill the first one in each region in short order, start opening the second one to people not in the first. Then the third and fourth if so deemed.

Take regoin 3 for example...You have all the Fresno, Motherlode, and Delta guys here. 200 guys to fill all four should be nothing under this format.

Just my 2 cents to see as many people able to compete under this excellent format....Johnny C

Brian D. · Post by **Brian D.** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:00 am

macinckirk · Post by **macinckirk** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:24 am

B's got some time on his hands

Nice can you do something like that pic for all the orgs dates and send me a copy so I can just look at 1 pice of paper

Brian D. · Post by **Brian D.** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:32 am

I had 20 min between meetings and thought I'd bust out a quick visual.

Nice can you do something like that pic for all the orgs dates and send me a copy
so I can just look at 1 pice of paper

-- funny guy. lol Oh, and although not in a graphic, I do have a spreadsheet that lists all the SoCal org derbys and dates for 2010 .

macinckirk · Post by **macinckirk** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:42 am

I'll take it

see you sat in line

sTony · Post by **sTony** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:53 am

My response is simple. Anyone thinking that yet another tournament org is the 'answer' to the industry woes simply isn't reading the marketplace very well.

All I read from this is there is yet another 20+ tournaments being run that, even if they go on Friday, are at odds with anything else that is already on the schedule. Look at the impact that the HBC, a Friday run event, can have on a pro-am that meets on the same Friday and fishes on Saturday/Sunday. You just can't be in two places at one time.

Run this program on a Wednesday and now you are truly not in competition with anyone else that already holds a permit. Personally I think the concept might fly, but it would have been nice to see the organizers implement the idea at the DFG Permit Jamboree so everyone could have accounted for it when drawing permits and putting a calendar together. As it is right now it's just another org that is going to place tournaments on the backs of other orgs after the fact, which really kind of sucks as it defeats the purpose of the Jamboree.

Side note: For the record and solely because it was addressed here in this thread, Tom L is not banned from this website. He posted in violation of our forum policies and was made inactive until which time he called and talked to me. Regardless of how that phone conversation goes he'd be re-instated. Tom hasn't made that phone call as of yet. So all Tom has to do is make the call and he's switched back on. Same goes for anyone that was put on our inactive list.

sTony

Levy · Post by **Levy** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:02 am

sTony wrote:Personally I think the concept might fly, but it would have been nice to see the organizers implement the idea at the DFG Permit Jamboree so everyone could have accounted for it when drawing permits and putting a calendar together. As it is right now it's just another org that is going to place tournaments on the backs of other orgs after the fact, which really kind of sucks as it defeats the purpose of the Jamboree.

sTony

you mean like AC pulling excessive permits to ensure they could schedule thier events on top of WCB.

sTony · Post by **sTony** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:24 am

Levy wrote:
sTony wrote:Personally I think the concept might fly, but it would have been nice to see the organizers implement the idea at the DFG Permit Jamboree so everyone could have accounted for it when drawing permits and putting a calendar together. As it is right now it's just another org that is going to place tournaments on the backs of other orgs after the fact, which really kind of sucks as it defeats the purpose of the Jamboree.

sTony
you mean like AC pulling excessive permits to ensure they could schedule thier events on top of WCB.

They're ALL pulling excessive permits to my mind Levy. Any team org out there that has a single lake region is breaking what the marketplace will allow.

And not you nor does anyone else have a shred of proof that AC intentionally put their pro ams on top of WCB. You couldn't because they didn't.

sTony

WackySenko · Post by **WackySenko** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:34 am

It is also hard to say that this new tournament format is putting on a tournament schedule to compete with the other orgs until you see the schedule. They have a right to put on tournaments whenever permits allow. If the other orgs loss anglers it must be because this circuit sounds better than what the anglers were fishing. It is up to the anglers to decide which org puts on a better show.
Even if they had put things together and had been at the draw, there would still be complaints. LET IT REST AND SEE HOW THE CHIPS FALL.

bigdaddys · Post by **bigdaddys** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:48 am

i think its cool. ill fish it.the great thing about multiple orgs, is we can choose which one we like. imagine if there were only one in california, it would be a monopoly. we anglers would be at thier mercy on so many levels. when i owned my pool hall in oroville, i fished a couple of circuits, and a club. i reality i only wanted to fish one circuit. in my opinion, it was ran much better than most. but i supported all. i will support this one. dont worry about the opposition gary, new players always bring some complaining at first!!

acm95301 · Post by **acm95301** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:51 am

I think this tourney is a great Idea. I'd like to hear more about how the local events will register the contestants, so that its isnt the same 50 at each event.

The Idea of a Mid-week or Friday deal is awesome for me.

Lugnut · Post by **Lugnut** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:46 pm

492slayer wrote:Sounded good until it states only Pro's and no amatuers. The format is very progressive, but if you are a working man and don't have the abilities to fish as a pro, your SOL? I mean $118 is one heck of a bargain. At that rate I could easily compete on any of the lakes (Oroville, Berryessa, Shasta...). Let's wait and see how things shape up

I was thinking the same thing. What are the actual qualifications of a "pro"? In most circuits it's just the diffrence in entry fees, correct? I do not want to take away from someone with sponsors, or that is making a living at this. But it does sounds like an AWESOME Tournament Trail and I would be willing to pony up the $118 right now.

Robert F · Post by **Robert F** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:55 pm

Lugnut wrote:
492slayer wrote:Sounded good until it states only Pro's and no amatuers. The format is very progressive, but if you are a working man and don't have the abilities to fish as a pro, your SOL? I mean $118 is one heck of a bargain. At that rate I could easily compete on any of the lakes (Oroville, Berryessa, Shasta...). Let's wait and see how things shape up
I was thinking the same thing. What are the actual qualifications of a "pro"? In most circuits it's just the diffrence in entry fees, correct? I do not want to take away from someone with sponsors, or that is making a living at this. But it does sounds like an AWESOME Tournament Trail and I would be willing to pony up the $118 right now.

That is exactly what they are counting on. $118 is little money so the remaining 80 percent of the field will participate without feeling stung. Just like a poker tournament. Anybody heard of the term deadmoney?

Steve Reed · Post by **Steve Reed** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:18 pm

By Pro they mean that there is only one division. Anyone who fishes is fishing pro. Thats it. No defining what makes anyone pro or what not. You pay your $118 and you are in.

Gary Dobyns · Post by **Gary Dobyns** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:38 pm

Levy I don't think A/C did this. I have heard it many times also, but don't think it's true. There was a meeting between the 2 parties a month or so back. Not sure of all that transpired. I have not got to the point of setting my own schedule. I would hope that if there are a bunch of conflicts that it gets worked out. Everyone loses with conflicts. The orgs and the fishermen.

Larry V. is a long time friend of mine. He changed fishing as we knew it then with the invention of the Pro-Am concept. This was 100% Larry's baby. But going head to head with A/C is a loser for WCB.

mark poulson · Post by **mark poulson** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:57 pm

I don't know about NoCal, but down here in SoCal we work out conflicts right there at the DFG Jamboree in July.
When we leave, everyone's settled on their schedules.
And there's no blood spilt.

Chad L. Dwyer · Post by **Chad L. Dwyer** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:58 pm

I am one that is intrigued by this format that hasn't fished (tournaments) in a long time.

Sounds simple. Pay $118.00 to fish on the business end of the boat for a nice purse, pile of braggin rights and comraderie like the good 'ol days. I like it.

RipnRog · Post by **RipnRog** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:12 pm

Chad L. Dwyer wrote:I am one that is intrigued by this format that hasn't fished (tournaments) in a long time.

Sounds simple. Pay $118.00 to fish on the business end of the boat for a nice purse, pile of braggin rights and comraderie like the good 'ol days. I like it.

Chad you coming back?

Chad L. Dwyer · Post by **Chad L. Dwyer** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:15 pm

I miss the guys, miss the competition but have no love for the politics. Frankly, that is what makes this sound interesting.

Can I fish out of my Malibu???

Xbass365 · Post by **Xbass365** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:17 pm

If everyone Fished as much as they Bitched, all of the tournaments would be full!!

mark poulson · Post by **mark poulson** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:22 pm

Brian D, you rock!

acm95301 · Post by **acm95301** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:23 pm

It doesn't take anything to declare yourself pro except your own intentions, but If you fish pro will other organization ever recognise you as a AM ever again?

If your one of these guys whose name get's remembered for a top finish, you will certainly be marked as a pro, and not allowed to go back.

Chad L. Dwyer · Post by **Chad L. Dwyer** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:34 pm

I believe most AM circuits base your "Pro" (or not) status on your winnings....I could be wrong.

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