Coming ETHANOL fuel line problems on BBC forums---WOW

[XMAN]

I usually go to bass boat central once a day under ranger forums..well today they had a thread with a headline on ethanol fuel lines--it had a side thread showing what ethanol does to fuel lines in short amount of time--it also showed a guy who had an 08 triton with a fuel/water separater filter who together with his mechanic was trying to find a problem--they took the filter off and dumped it out in a container and it was loaded with black rubber particles from the fuel line and bulb..this is only after 2 years..every boat out there could have this problem..it also suggests what lines to be using and what to look for....i'll be changing mine soon after reading this..very good read...and in december they may vote on a 15% eth/gas EPA blend..we are now 8-10%...XMAN

[BuckSnort]

It's a good idea to use Sta-bil

[Team Fugowee]

Now you can have 15% Ethanol, 15% water and 70% low octain gas. More old gas engines burned up due to bad gas. Now the gas station operators can increase their volume by adding at least 10% water to each tanker drop.

[Bill K]

That is why, all the mechanics and other programs have been telling us to put the Marine Stabil into our fuel, all the time. Just follow directions on the bottle. Either for storage or running.
It can save you much time, trouble and money. Bill K

[civicrr]

Guys, the Marine Stabil helps to prevent phase separation. It does not prevent the corrosive effects ethanol has on the fuel lines.

This latest surge in fuel line posts was caused by a guy loosing his motor due to fuel line deterioration. Fuel lines caused restriction which in turn caused a lean burn....then melt down.

As I posted on the other forum, the thing that got me to change my lines was meeting a guy on the launch ramp @ Orwood. Hearing about his near miss got me going. Do it yourself. It takes maybe two hours max & about $60-$70. It isn't hard. Cheap insurance if you ask me.

[Bill K]

Guys, the Marine Stabil helps to prevent phase separation. It does not prevent the corrosive effects ethanol has on the fuel lines.

This latest surge in fuel line posts was caused by a guy loosing his motor due to fuel line deterioration. Fuel lines caused restriction which in turn caused a lean burn....then melt down.

As I posted on the other forum, the thing that got me to change my lines was meeting a guy on the launch ramp @ Orwood. Hearing about his near miss got me going. Do it yourself. It takes maybe two hours max & about $60-$70. It isn't hard. Cheap insurance if you ask me.

All the info I have recieved on Marine Stabil, says that it does reduce/stop rubber detereation. That is why it came out alongwith the standard Stabil, of old. For what it is worth. Bill K

[civicrr]

All the info I have recieved on Marine Stabil, says that it does reduce/stop rubber detereation. That is why it came out alongwith the standard Stabil, of old. For what it is worth. Bill K

Well, I read the tiny print on the bottle. It does say it helps prevent corrosion of tanks, hose, etc. It appears I was....wrong.

[offduty]

Guys

If you read the whole thread it looks a fuel line issue. After reading I will be changing the tank to motor fuel lines to the newer more ethanol resistant ones. It appears the older style lines were not manufactured for fuels with ethanol and they can fail internally and cause a lean burn condition that will blow a motor. Looks like a cheap upgrade to protect an expensive investment. Also if you search on BBC boards this is not the first time this has happened and a thread started on the topic.

Rich

[Bill K]

I have been told and have read, that the use of the marine Stabil (I do not, nor am a sponsor of them, just a customer) that it will protect all the little rubber parts in our engines. Not just fuel lines, but small rubber gaskets, etc that are inside the engine/carb/injector areas, as well. I will use it, as it is one more way to protect my engines from our great Ethanol fuel, which the GARB and state has placed upon us. Bill K

[mark poulson]

So Ethanol, the great corn fuel "savior", costs us all more in fuel additive, lowers our mpg so we have to buy more fuel, and winds up generating more carbon in the entire growing, harvesting, and refining process than the old, plain gas.
Sounds like progress to me.

[eagle123777]

why not just buy fuel without ethanol...maybe a lil more expensive but in the long run with all the problems is 10 or 15 cents a gallon worth it...until chevron puts that lil ethanol sign on its pumps will buy the good stuff...

[Norcalbasspro]

Great point.

[civicrr]

Bill K., good plan. I use Marine Stabil & Mercury Quickleen with every gallon. Mercury has a new product out called Quickare. I was thinking about trying it vs Marine Stabil. Reading up on both products, on their own websites, looks like they both claim to help prevent problems. Basically $.10/gallon for both products.

Quickare – Add to every fill-up
* Maximizes engine performance with all grades of gasoline
* Helps control corrosion, gum and varnish build-up, and phase separation associated with ethanol-blended fuel
* Helps control moisture and corrosion problems associated with non-ethanol fuel
* Cleans up existing varnish and gum deposits from fuel lines, tanks, carburetors and injectors, intake valves, and spark plugs
* Keeps fuel fresh between fill-ups – up to 3 months


Marine Formula STA-BIL
* America's #1 Selling Marine Fuel Additive Brand!
* BEST Ethanol Problem Fighter
* More than FOUR TIMES the Fuel System Cleaner than in Regular STA-BIL
* DOUBLE the corrosion preventer than in Regular STA-BIL
* Prevents corrosion from moisture & ethanol-induced water attraction
* Improves marine engine performance YEAR-ROUND, not just for seasonal storage

Seems like they are claiming protection by not allowing phase separation or additional water to be attracted. Whatever the case, I'll continue to use one or the other. Cheap insurance really.


I thought all the gas in CA had ethanol as mandated by CARB. I'll have to cruise by the Chevron to check it out.

Wasn't the excuse/reason to switch from MTBE to Ethanol was because MTBE was leaching into ground water?

[mr.bass91]

Chevron gas contains ethanol just like the rest. At the last chevron I filled up at last week there was a sign on the pump that stated that the gas " may contain up to 10% ethanol".

[ash]

I am sure Guy Kelly can post about his MAJOR issues with the affects of Ethonal on bass boats and fuel lines....

[Shad*Wizard]

Yeah, I went down to the local Chevron in Pittsburg today...No visible sticker that I could see...Went across the street to the Shell, no sticker visible there either...Checked Chevron's site and it said 70 % of the gas they sell has ethanol in it...

[Bill K]

Yeah, I went down to the local Chevron in Pittsburg today...No visible sticker that I could see...Went across the street to the Shell, no sticker visible there either...Checked Chevron's site and it said 70 % of the gas they sell has ethanol in it...

Two things, I bet you would be really, really hard pressed to find any fuel at California stations that does not have Ethanol in it. Most will average 10% and I hear the state is going to require a higher level shortly.
The other thing, I read were it takes enough corn ,to make the amount of Ethonol for one tank full, in the average vehicle, that that corn amount would feed a family of four one year.
Now tell me our governement is saving money, etc. etc. Bill K

[blkdog812]

the ethanol is even eating up / deteriorating the liners of the epa approved fuel lines. it looks like pieces of hard plastic when it cuts loss.
if it does go, it will plug stuff up and cause the motor to burn lean and it will burn it down.

done tests of fuel from several stations in the central valley lately. the ethanol content has been testing between 4.5 - 6%

if your grey fuel lines has the red or orange writting on it, be a good idea to replace it.

[civicrr]

the ethanol is even eating up / deteriorating the liners of the epa approved fuel lines. it looks like pieces of hard plastic when it cuts loss.
if it does go, it will plug stuff up and cause the motor to burn lean and it will burn it down.

The lines that have 'EPA Compliant' written them are new for 2010. They have blue writing. Are you seeing failures in these lines?

if your grey fuel lines has the red or orange writting on it, be a good idea to replace it.

These lines were pre-2010. They didn't say 'EPA Compliant' in blue writing. The lines with the orange writing were the generation before the blue writing/EPA Compliant lines. IIRC, they say alcohol resistant. Pictures of these lines failing can be found on the BBC 3L forum sticky 'common questions'. Look for posts containing the word ethanol also one entitled 'performance problems'

[blkdog812]

one of the lines they showed me, that failed, was less than 6 months old epa approved line

[b2customrods]

Just go to your local race track and get ya a 55 gal drum off 100 octane. Dont know what it costs now but when I was racing I used 118 octane for over 10.00 per gallon.

When I ran a alcohol motor we had to drain all the fuel out of the car the next day or the lines would break down not to mention what it did to the carburetors.

Another item on alcohol is that it takes allot more alcohol to develop the same amount of hp as gasoline. Benefit for alcohol is it burns cooler.

So I guess now were going to see Flexfuel boats and motors

[ACRon]

How come we are not hearing about the same problems with cars and trucks? Do they use a different type of fuel line?

[b2customrods]

allot of the fuel line is aluminum tubing plus I believe the flexible part holds up to ethanol in the newer cars. Ethanol has been in fuel for years now. Were just seeing much more in it now.

Your flex fuel cars and trucks have all there lines made for ethanol.

I remember back in 86 I had a 3/4 ton 3 door Suburban 4X4 that had a 350 Ci motor with a old style four barrel that used the black floats. I put in some cheap gas that had alcohol in it. Those floats swelled up like balloons with alcohol and stuck the float valve open. Flooded the carb. Couldnt get the damn truck to run for nothing. I replace that carb with a Holley dbl pumper with brass floats. Never had that issue again. I did have to add a fuel filter just before the carburetor to prevent small pieces of fuel line that had corroded from getting in the carb. Those little pieces can clog jets and still prevent the float valve from closing.

Now my race car I finally changed over from alcohol due to all the hassles of draining all the fuel and tacking my carbs apart to drain them. It was a hell of a pain. Went to 118 fuel with no alcohol in it. Great stuff. If I ran the car in my garage I had to put on a full face respirator within 5 minutes or my eyes would sting like hell and you couldnt breath.

You should check with your outboard motors mechanic and see what he suggests for your specific motor. Im not sure what the line is from the fuel filter to the injectors are. Im sure if you have a carbed motor you should really look into a small filter just before the carb.

You could also look at using the higher grad fuel like 91 octane. I believe it has less alcohol in it. Alcohol helps stop pinging in lower octane fuel. It doesnt stop it all but it does help.

[offduty]

Does anyone know where we can buy these new 2010 EPA Compliant fuel lines with the blue EPA compliant writing?. A link would be awesome,
Rich

[Bill K]

I have not check, but I would think that NAPA and other major parts store would have it. And maybe the major boat dealer/repair shops. Bill K