DFG???

[Levy]

Since my post was deleted form the other thread I figured I would try again.

I am sure I am going to get bashed and blasted for my thoughts but I have seen enough. I am sick of everybody making excuses for DFG lack of money, manpower, pay ect. Leaders and doers don't make excuses they just get things done.

Frankly in my opinion the Cal DFG does not get things done they only make excuses of why they can't!!!

1st of all If DFG wants to come to every bass tourney to observe, give out advice, listen to the fishermen or arrest folks for unauthorized activities more power to them for doing thier job. I am sick and tired of everyone being polically correct and discussing any need to kiss there behind. This is there job and if they are only going to focus on Bass tourney fishermen they are missing the boat as usual. I am all for volunteering and helping improve our environment and fisheries. I also encourage and would be glad to share info with them but frankly they don't ever ask for advice and they are notorious for just doing things without all of the facts.

It would be great if they actually got out of the office and on a boat once in awhile to start addressing the real problem which is unlicensed fishermen and poachers which there are many. The Poachers and fisherman are in plain view and don't even hide anymore. (Why should they) The Cal tip line is useless. I called the tip line 5 times this spring and at least 15 times over the past 2 years to report unlicensed folks and poachers (the same folks everyday) near Rivers End marina and the operators either had no idea where I was talking about or said that there was nothing they could do. I have been fishing the south Delta about 3-4 days a week for almost 2 years now and I have yet to see even 1 DFG person out checking for poachers or licenses. I wear my license with pride and have nothing to hide. I wish just once the DFG would come out and check my license and talk to me, I will be glad to share my thoughts and idea's.

The DFG in its present form is almost useless. They recently changed Sturgeon regs without having the slightest clue of what is really going on with the species and fishery.

Again they need to get on a boat and make there presence known on the water. They also need to start talking to the guides, charter captains and regular fisherman who will gladly share information concerning problems and share ideas to improve our fisheries.

Let the bashing begin

Jon Levenson

[DeltaDan]

The DFG in its present form is almost useless. They recently changed Sturgeon regs without having the slightest clue of what is really going on with the species and fishery.

I was there....... attended two of the meetings and although "THEN" I did not agree with the commision and the Biologist -- as well as the party charters that felt even more against it than I because it IS their livelyhood........... The Sturegon Fishery is indeed recovering and quite nicely !

~~~> http://www.theoutdoorsforum.com/forums/ ... topic=3127

Ask Kevin Youst who is the Captain of Lucky Strike Fishing his perspective of the Sturgon rulling to protect our fishery until it comes back in full scale once again.... someday as long as we can protect our waters as well. (they all go hand in hand)



Not all of these came into being the norm of fears that existed when first brought to the table........

~~> http://www.theoutdoorsforum.com/forums/ ... topic=3035

This was overruled/nulified by the Commision on a mutual agreement for a BIGGER Slot limit resulting form all of the 3 meetings of everyones public input. Thankfully the limit in not "only" up to 56" -- We got another 10...........

~~> http://www.theoutdoorsforum.com/forums/ ... topic=2395


I was at the Vallejo and Antioch meetings ....... Got to shake alot of hands from both the Public and Wardens presant, Marty Gringas (Biologist) and shared a cup of coffee with Mr. Flores outside for 10 minuets alone at the Antioch one and voice my concearns and have my questions by him to every single one of them togther.


Cheers,
Dan

aka - SierraExplorer



Edit: Typo and I imagine I did not get all of them.......

[Steve]

Levy, I concur. But, I would add that the agency needs to base management decisions on data. This will not happen; decisions are political, have nothing to do with data, and probably never will. Its the Fish and Game Commission appointees (not part of DFG) that make the decisions. None of the appointees, to my knowledge, have biological backgrounds (If Ive failed to do my homework on the issue, I apologize ahead of time). They are nothing but political appointees and Im sure you can figure out what is wrong with that.

Also, why would a warden write a ticket to somebody that likely would not pay the fine (i.e. poachers and the like who dont have liscenses or abide by the regs)? Bass fishermen are specifically targeted because they know the fine will be paid, and revenues from fines likely account for a good percentage of monies keeping the agencies nose above water.

With that said, I also want to point out that DFG employs many excellent biologists who know how to do the right thing. Its just that sometimes their efforts are squashed by the way the system works within the agency (I hope that makes sense).

[sTony]

My only response is that it seems that most all your concerns are with the enforcement wing of the DFG. They are underfunded and they make no bones about that.

I've seen the biologists out there on many bodies of water personally. I've also seen the wardens. Some are very aggressive and some are more laid back but I've seen or experienced their presence many times on the water on a variety of lakes.

My personal experience with folks like now retired Dennis Lee as well as Kyle Murphy, Terry Foreman, Mike Giusti and several others has always been extremely informative.

And even the private individual can have input into the processes by which DFG does it's job every time the Fish and Game Commission meets.

If we're going to lay blame, the failings here seem to be squarely on the shoulders of anglers as well, who never mustered up enough support from their own ranks to have a meaningful impact on the politicians that set our laws. If the recreational interests spoke as one we'd have one mighty loud voice in Sacramento.

sTony

[Dewayne]

Not sure how much you have tried dealing with DFG. I have contacted them several times over the years. I have always found them to be very helpful in answering my questions and very appreciative of my feedback. There is a set process to get things done and if you take the time to understand the process they are willing to work with us to drive for improvements.

Much of the stuff that happens at Clear Lake is due to a few anglers there that complain to the DFG and ask them to investigate the tournaments. It's is the anglers who have the agenda more than the DFG.

[Trackerbass]

So what is the set process for reporting poachers? Levy is my fishing partner and I was there for a least half those Cal Tip calls.We got zero response. The poachers were out there every day for at least two months. Fishing with live bait and everything , 6 inches or 6 pounds went in the bucket. It started with one boat, then two and then a half a dozen. Why? Because nothing was done about it! Having great biologists on staff is good, but what's the purpose,really, if the limits and restrictions they set are not enforced? I fish by the book not because I might get caught but because I believe it's the right thing to do for the fishery. The reality is you won't get caught. So if you don't fish tournys or care about fish populations, don't bother buying a license and keep all you want!

[uglystyx]

what my buddy has done before in the past is to talk to a warden when he see's one, and ask for his buisness card. most of the time they will have their cell phone # on it and he usually gets a waaaayyy better response than calling CALTIPS. we've been on parts fo the delta where we've found gillnets and people using throw nets, and has called to a warden that handed him a card. they responded to it actually. not fast, but they still responded to it.

[FISH2WIN55]

Levy,
You have to understand that money and other factors are not excuses but are what a lot of our law enforcement agencies operate with everyday. It is really said how many game wardens are on staff in our area. It would be a perfect world if they had all the money in the world to staff as many people as possible. If you think you can do a better job with you and two of your friends to cover all of Lake county than I suggest that you tak p a new career. I am really getting tired of all this DFG bashing. They are understaffed as well as Lake county sheriff and CHP. Instead of slamming the DFG why don't we take this energy to see what we can do to help. If you really feel that strongly, get involved by helping not complaining.

[BassManDan]

There is a whole laundry list of reasons that people can spout out about DFG and how they doo everything wrong.

They have good aspects and bad aspects. Enforcement division is just like regular cops, some are cool and understanding of yor mistakes or if you are really doing no harm, others are total goons.

Management division, very political and anthropocentric, "people need water more than Delta smelt", a statement by DFG, all they are really doing is watching every year the smelt population decline, thats due to politics anf having no money to do anyhting about it anyway.

Cast stones for problems which you know are true, I do as well, but don't blanket DFG as evil, for the most part, they're doing what they can with what they've got.

Bass Man Dan

[fishwithron2]

I do believe DFG are targeting the wrong people. Mostly bass fisherman and not those guys out there in those small aluminum boats who keeps everything undersize and all. Even if they don't ticket those people, at least consficate their equipments.
Had a gal check me out one day when I was coming out of the water. She went thru my whole boat under my jacket and everything and couldn't find anything wrong. She'll never catch me as I practice CPR. She was going to write me up as I didn't fill out my license with all the info like address and ect. Did have my name , drivers license and birthdare on it but that wasn't enough.
Problem is all our money for license and stamps goes into general funds which it shouldn't. It should go back to DFG.
Would you want to be a warden with college degree and make less than $40K ayear or be a CHP and make $50K ayear with a high school diploma ?

[UhSon]

A while back i heard that the head official for DFG had never even owned a fishing or hunting license. (which might explain why the costs and problems keep going up) If you want a change, you need to start at the top with the politicians. And on a side note, if you think DFG is bad, just hope you dont ever come across a Federal warden.... 10 x worse! Just ask a duck hunter... (thats what unlimited funding gets ya)

[Levy]

Levy,
You have to understand that money and other factors are not excuses but are what a lot of our law enforcement agencies operate with everyday. If you think you can do a better job with you and two of your friends to cover all of Lake county than I suggest that you take p a new career. I am really getting tired of all this DFG bashing. They are understaffed as well as Lake county sheriff and CHP. Instead of slamming the DFG why don't we take this energy to see what we can do to help. If you really feel that strongly, get involved by helping not complaining.

I don't have to understand anything. I have served this country during 2 wars and paid excessive taxes for the right to complain about waste and mismanagement in our government and its agencies. Again I see a lot of people on here making excuses for DFG. Just so we are clear I have nothing against them personally I just see them as a useless entity that gets nothing done. (I am still trying to find any good aspects of the cal DFG as one poster suggested) and yes I know I could do a better job!!! (They are more then welcome to send me an offer letter and we can discuss my future employment.)

All I can state are the facts, my license fee's go up every year and I get nothing in return for my purchase. I would be out of business if I ran my company that way (by the way I also have a very under funded budget but I make it work). What good are DFG Biologist if they cannot get someone to enforce the rules that they impose. (The delta pumps are still running and in 2 years I have been fishing the delta I have yet to see even one warden on the water so the poaching goes on unchecked.) Why pay to setup and man a cal tip line if they have no intention of responding to tips??? In my mind the DFG only hurts and takes advantage of anglers and folks who make thier living on the fishery. These are people who generally follow the rules and they fail to address the real problem which is poaching. The new Sturgeon Regs are the perfect example, despite the best sturgeon fishing in years they imposed the new slot limits and the worthless punch cards. This only hurts the charter captains and all law abiding citizens and does nothing to address the real problem of poachers who could care less about punch cards or slot limits. (Again why should they care since there is no enforcement?)

[Mark Hiser]

Well, first off let me say Thank You for serving in two wars for this country and the right to complain. I haven't served in any wars, but I have and still do, pay an excessive amount of taxes for the right to voice my opinion. Your right, The Calif. DFG isn't run very well, many of the programs don't work well or at all. I won't make any excuses, however I will point out a couple facts- the Turkey Transplant program is a phenominal success. There wouldn't be a Chukar in this state without DFG. We have a rapidly expanding Elk population with Bulls that exceed 400 inches of antler score. The Spotted Bass introduction in many waters in this state has been a great success, we have the ability to enjoy world class fishing for them up here at Shasta and Whiskeytown. The Catchable trout restocking program in Calif. allows tens of thousands of folks to fish and catch trout every year.The DFG isn't to blame for poachers and other evil bastards, it's those folks themselves. I see wardens several times a month, both on land and water. How often do you or anyone else on this board get stopped on a state hiway? There are many CHP officers, yet I have gone 30 years and not been stopped or had my license checked. They only have to patrol the pavement, DFG is supposed to cover every inch of real estate in the entire state. Your right, the poachers are stealing from you and everyone else in this state. Why do we allow it? Why not stop them right then?

Mark Hiser

[mac (Doyle McEwen)]

Levy, you most definitely have the right to complain..I don't think this forum is the right place to do it though..Not that I am against what you have said or how you said it, but would it not be more beneficial to complain directly to the DFG..Perhaps you have tried, I don't know if you have or not..If you have complained to them directly, have you gotten any responses at all..I can easily agree with your view on the poaching concerns and a lack of response to your CALTIPS calls..There should be something any of us could do to try and make this situation better..I just don't see posting on this forum as a way of accomplishing that..It would be great if it were though..

mac

[Phil]

GOSH I HATE TO SAY ANYTHING, BUT I HAVE BEEN HUNTING AND FISHING LETS SAY FOR ALOMST 50 YEARS NOW IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, I HAVE SEEN MANY WARDENS AND HAVE RECEIVED MUCH INFORMATION FROM THEM AND HAVE YET TO MEET ONE THAT HAS A BAD ATTITUDE........THEY ARE UNDERSTAFFED BUT I THINK THEY LIKE IT THAT WAY....UNDER FUNDED I DOUBT IT VERY MUCH ! STOP BY A DFG YARD SOMETIME. LOOK AT ALL THE TRUCKS, CARS, BOATS ETC LAYING AROUND !! WOW WISH I HAD ONE OF THEM DRIFT BOATS !!! I SAY WE LEAVE THEM ALONE FOR A CHANGE !!!

JIGS

[FISH2WIN55]

I agree the DFG is not perfect, but I have never seen an organization or business who is. You said "they are a useless entity that gets NOTHING done," I think the post two above mine is something. They do patrol a lot of ground and water.
You wrote "my license fees go up every year and i get nothing in return for my purchuse." In case you haven't noticed everything has gone up every year. They have to put gas in their trucks. They have to maintain their equipment. They have a lot of costs in their department.
You wrote"why pay to set up and man a cal tip line if they have no intention of responding to tips". This goes back to having no money and being undermaned (not an excuse a fact). Take Lake county for instance. If two wardens are out hwy 20 looking into a Tule Elk poacher and 1 is at a elementary school educating young children about the joys of the outdoors, then you call at county park, they might not be able to get to your call. There are not very many wardens, they do what they can.
I am not saying they are perfect. There is always room for improvement, but I do believe that they are working and doing what they can. I don't think they are useless or do nothing to help our wildlife.

[Levy]

Mark, I am not nor have ever been a hunter so thanks for pointing out at least one DFG success story. I also agree that DFG is not to blame for poachers however it is just thier job to try to do something about it which I have never even seen them try to do.

Mac, I am not sure if this is the right place to complain or not, it is however a good place to see if others are as frustrated as I am. As of now I have never got a response back from the DFG Directors or Gov office.

[Mark Hiser]

Levy, Glad I could point out a couple success stories, I have shared your frustration with the DFG, My father worked for them, My ex-Father in law worked for them and at one time I wanted to make it my career ( you won't have many new bass boats workin for DFG), I have been and still am frustrated with a nationality of folks who this country imported and supports, who's ideals allow them to sit on the bank and fill 5 gallon buckets with fish of all sizes, who travel into country sides and kill all species of wildlife and then if they are ticketed,claim with the help of a court appointed counselor" ignorance, cultural differences, and language barriers" as the reason, and then the judge lets it go!!!! I have chosen to go meet a couple of the New Wardens in my area, they have given me their contact info, and I have delivered to them the time, place, vehicle info and personal I.D's when possible to help them make their case. They are very receptive and have shown that they will attempt to apprehend the stinkin little perps. My gut feeling and passion for my sport ( read life) sometimes causes me to want to shoot the bastards through the guts with a broadhead, but then I remember they won't let me out on the weekends to fish tournies Don't give up your passion for your life sport, I still believe we can outlast the bastards.

Mark Hiser

[Levy]

Levy, Glad I could point out a couple success stories, I have shared your frustration with the DFG, My father worked for them, My ex-Father in law worked for them and at one time I wanted to make it my career ( you won't have many new bass boats workin for DFG), I have been and still am frustrated with a nationality of folks who this country imported and supports, who's ideals allow them to sit on the bank and fill 5 gallon buckets with fish of all sizes, who travel into country sides and kill all species of wildlife and then if they are ticketed,claim with the help of a court appointed counselor" ignorance, cultural differences, and language barriers" as the reason, and then the judge lets it go!!!! I have chosen to go meet a couple of the New Wardens in my area, they have given me their contact info, and I have delivered to them the time, place, vehicle info and personal I.D's when possible to help them make their case. They are very receptive and have shown that they will attempt to apprehend the stinkin little perps. My gut feeling and passion for my sport ( read life) sometimes causes me to want to shoot the bastards through the guts with a broadhead, but then I remember they won't let me out on the weekends to fish tournies Don't give up your passion for your life sport, I still believe we can outlast the bastards.

Mark Hiser

Well said Mark. I will try to find out the names and numbers of some local DFG wardens that are responsible for the South Delta so I can try to speak with them directly.

[kayaking4fish]

To nobody in particular:

If you want to make a difference you have to do more.

Just calling CAL-TIP when you think something wrong is going on is the barest minimum possible you could do. Even if there is a warden nearby just waiting for your call the chances are slim they can reach you and then also see the same issues you saw.

What to do to do more:

Have the local sheriff departments phone number where you are fishing available and also call them. There are more sheriffs around than wardens. Then try local police, then CHP, also let the local harbormasters know as well.

When calling any agency have a lot of information available to pass on. Get as much information as possible: boat type, boat color, boat registration numbers, license plate numbers. Numbers of people fishing, specify exactly what you saw. TAKE PICTURES, offer to forward or email the pictures also. Get GPS numbers, nearest marinas and roads, any obvious local landmarks. Oh and the single most important thing leave them your contact information. DFG isn't going to waste time on a call that they cannot verify or contact the caller at a later date. But if you can provide them with a lot of information that they can act on at a later date there is a much better chance of things happening.

I have heard that a lot of the CAL-TIP calls go something like this:
"Hi this is a concerned fisherman and I just saw some unlicensed fisherman out at the red barn keeping what looks like to many fish and of the wrong size. Please go do something about this."

That isn't enough.

One last thing just because you don't see the wardens doesn't mean they are not around. It would be much harder for them to catch poachers etc. if they were cruising around announcing there presence in the area.

It is a problem but it is one that we as concerned fisherman can do more about.

Jeff

[NaCl]

I want DFG to give me a license to hunt poachers! I'll even purchase my own night scope so I can use the license 24 hours a day! HAR HAR!

.....NaCl

[Trackerbass]

Making their presence known is EXACTLY what they should be doing. The lowlifes might tell their friends not to go there instead of inviting more.

To the guy who hasn't been pulled over in 30 yrs.
Try driving around without your license plates and see how much attention you get. You WILL get stopped and checked. Just like you should for not having your fishing license displayed. You don't have to worry because your an honest guy and on the up and up. Those who are not so honest shouldn't be so damn comfortable out in the open.

[Mark Hiser]

I would second that although with a few minor stipulations; 1. No limit on scumbags. 2. Once you have a confirmed extermination of the varmit, you must fully recover them and deposit at a proper recepticle. 3. A $5.00 rebate on "approved extermination ammo" from the manufacturers. 4.I get to be the president and lead exterminator for the first year

I like the way you stack up Dean

Mark Hiser

[Mike Thomas]

I would second that although with a few minor stipulations; 1. No limit on scumbags. 2. Once you have a confirmed extermination of the varmit, you must fully recover them and deposit at a proper recepticle. 3. A $5.00 rebate on "approved extermination ammo" from the manufacturers. 4.I get to be the president and lead exterminator for the first year

I like the way you stack up Dean

Mark Hiser

Two questions
#1 What is defined as a proper recepticle?
#2 Are there any restrictions on method of take?
I'm thinkin a .338 Lapua......and maybe an RPG to take care of the straglers

edit: I mispelled recepticle like a CHAMP!!

[Greg_Cornish]

In Indian valley poaching is rampant. On my infrequent trips, I find setlines up there every time with the owners about 1/4 mile off. We pull up and drag em out in front of them, tangle them all up, put the string in a garbage sack and steal their hooks and sinkers. They never say a word.

[Phil]

I would second that although with a few minor stipulations; 1. No limit on scumbags. 2. Once you have a confirmed extermination of the varmit, you must fully recover them and deposit at a proper recepticle. 3. A $5.00 rebate on "approved extermination ammo" from the manufacturers. 4.I get to be the president and lead exterminator for the first year

I like the way you stack up Dean

Mark Hiser

WHERE CAN I BUY THE LICENSE ????????? I COULD SELL A DOZEN TODAY PROBABLY.............MARK; YOU ARN'T BY CHANCE RUNNING FOR SOME SORT OF GOVERNMENT OFFICE ARE YOU ?? HAR HAR HAR !!

[Mark Hiser]

Heck No!!! just tryin to do my part to leave the world a better place and maybe have a little fun while doin it

Mark Hiser