Are tournament fisherman better?

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:00 pm

Westernbass forum bass fishermen members are dominated by club and regional bass tournament fisherman. Reading the posted threads would lead you to believe that the tournament bass fishermen are superior bass fisherman than non tournament bass fishermen or women.
What is your opinion? do you believe the tournament fisherman catch bigger bass, more bass and heavier 5 bass daily limits on average than non tournament bass fisherman?
What is your; best personl big bass?
Best 5 bass limit weight?
Best day on the water catching bass?
Tom

LimitedOut · Post by **LimitedOut** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:35 pm

I am both in a club and fish regional tournaments and see a high level of talent from both groups. However I know plenty of guys who can stick it to 'em that just are not interested in the competition factor.

Ray L. · Post by **Ray L.** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:15 pm

You are talking a lot of factors here and there may be a major argument on this subject.
A Real tournament angler does have more expierience than your local or regional angler. Wait before you get your panties in a wad think about it. Time on the water is a key factor and also finding fish in a short time to be in contention. Most of the touring pro's go to many bodies of water with a short practice time and are able to find fish in a short time and at the same time figure out things it may take the regional guy many trips on the water to understand. Their learning curve and instincts are much sharper because of time on the water. Now as far as big fish go these guys do not look to get that type of fish they look for other things like will the size fish I have found win an event or just slide me through with a check. Yes they may stumble onto a big fish for a check during the tournament and that is a bonus.
They more look for an area or multiple areas that will produce enough fish to make the cut and fish the final day for a shot at winning.
There are more factors than this and this is just the tip of the iceburg so maybe you should think about your question again and you may find the answer as long as ego does not get in the way.
I have fished with some of the best and can tell you that 3 of the main factors that have come out of it are time on the water, making proper use of that time and being able to figure it out in just a short time with only a couple of bites under your belt.

Ray L. · Post by **Ray L.** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:16 pm

1 other thing are you only talking about our local ponds we call lakes or are talking about a real lake like Havasu, Clear Lake or places farther east.

Robert F · Post by **Robert F** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:31 pm

The biggest edge is the 411 network. It gets better as you go up. Some guys just make a few calls, some guys phone ring off the hook. Must be nice to be KVD.

Caveman · Post by **Caveman** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:59 am

I think the answer to this question can be found when you look at the fundamental reason why tournament poker has exploded with mass amateur participation while tournament fishing hasn't. First, consider that an amateur isn't likely to shell out big bucks to compete on an even field (ie. no handicap) with a seasoned pro in any sort of event unless they either have: A. Money to burn (ala Andy Beal); B. A book to write (ala George Plimpton); or C. An expectation of success.
It is the last reason that poker has exploded. A player can go online and in a year get the experience that it used to take a pro 10 years to achieve in a card room. The learning curve has excellerated exponentially because players can sit at home, any time of day or night, and get to play thousands of hands in the actual heat of battle. They become players with incredible amounts of tourney experience very quickly - and donâ€™t have to give up the day job to do it.
The same can't be said for fishing. Sure there is more written, video taped, posted on the internet, and offered on TV about fishing than ever. Today's fisherman can learn so much before they ever hit the water. But, there is no substitute for actual experience. Unfortunately, we canâ€™t get that lying in bed, wearing our PJâ€™s and tapping away on a keyboard. You have to hit the water ... OFTEN! That takes a time commitment that most people canâ€™t make. Hence, the amateurs have a rough time against the pros on the water but fare very well against them on the felt.
Iâ€™m not a tourney fisherman, but I have fished a lot and have studied fishing my entire life. I rarely get out-fished - even as a guest on someoneâ€™s home turf. If I got to fish against a pro from the same boat, with someone else on the trolling motor putting us on fish equally, then I think Iâ€™d have a fair shot though still be an underdog. But, put us in a real tournament situation in separate boats, I donâ€™t think Iâ€™d have a prayer.

Ricky-S · Post by **Ricky-S** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 6:45 am

Are professional athletes better than non-professional athletes?

The answer is sometimes yes and other times no. However, the platform of the media allows those that are professional to have better exposure and access at information which under most situations should result in better skills.

With that said, I am sure that there are endless numbers of KVD that never had the opportunity to showcase their skills. It's just like any other organized sport, there are those that did not make it that are just as good, if not better, than those that did.

With that said, if it was that easy, then everybody would be a pro. Don't fool yourself, most of these bigger named pro anglers are the real deal and have time on the water that the average weekend worrior can only dream about.

My best five fish in a tournament is 36 pounds on the Delta. My best five fish, period, is 45 pounds on Clear Lake. My biggest is a 14 pounder on the Delta. Best day on the water is always at Lake Shasta where 50-60 bass days are the norm and 100 bass days not uncommon.

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 10:05 am

The tournament bass fisherman should be the best at locatiing and catching young adult bass between 2 1/2 and 4 lbs. If a tournament bass fisherman can average 16 lb limits year around, they will be in the top of any club or organized bass fishing contest.
The exception is fishing on one lakes that have a good population of FLMB during pre-spwan or spawning periods.
The tournament fisherman spends their time on the water improving skills and tinkering with presentations to give them an edge over the other competitors. Tournament fisherman fishing for money must use lures, no live bait during a tournament.
Very few tournament fisherman have caught a bass over 12 lbs, a 5 bass limit over 40 lbs, most have had very good days on the water catching over 100 bass, a few a caught more than 5 big bass in one day.
The tournament fisherman fishes during week days to practice for a weekend contest. His or her goal is to catch a 5 bass limit that weighs enough to earn a check or be in the top 10.
The non tournament fisherman doesn't have any of those restrictions. They can select the day to fish , without restrictions. Target big bass or just fun fish without any pressure to succeed. Most good non tournamnet bass fisherman have caught bass over 12 lbs, 5 bass limits over 40 and have and good days catching over 100 bas a day, few have caught more than 5 big bass in one day.
We are different and must share the same water, so lets make a better effort to recognize that all bass fisherman have a right to fish and we are all very good bass fisherman with different goals.
Tom

Hillbilly in Cali · Post by **Hillbilly in Cali** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:09 pm

I think one would have to look at everyday performance. A pro fisherman can go to any lake in the country fish for two days and make it in the money for the tounament. If you take a local guy and put him with the pros, if the lake is like the lakes he fishes a lot and is the type of conditions he is good at and likes to fish, he can beat the pros. But can he do this every week?

sTony · Post by **sTony** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:14 pm

Oldschool wrote:If a tournament bass fisherman can average 16 lb limits year around, they will be in the top of any club or organized bass fishing contest.

Tom

Come on up to the Delta and Clear Lake and average 16 pounds per tournament and see what it gets you.

This stuff is really fun to argue about but the fact is if you ave ever watched an Elite Series angler closely do their thing you'd quickly realize in all ways, shapes and forms that they are truly head and shoulders above everyone else out their with the exception of a lot of the FLW Tour guys. They cast better, fish their baits better, they finesse better, they power better, they make decisions on the water far better, they have and understanding of the fish better, they network far better, and so on. I got to watch some of these guys at the Delta this past year and they are phenomenally good at just about everything they decide to do.

And I'm not saying they've all mastered every aspect of bass fishing but some are truly very versatile and others have master crafted their strengths.

I've watched Skeet Reese for years and fondly remember back years ago when the ISE shows used to have a large casting pool and they'd run competitions and Skeet could do things with his pitches that no one else could come close to duplicating.

There are some incredibly skilled anglers that have no inclination at all to go across country and compete. But aside from the big bass guys, I'm not sure I know of all that many anglers that absolutely spank the fish that don't eventually get in to the competitive end of things.

sTony

Joe Bruce · Post by **Joe Bruce** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:44 pm

tourney guys are generally better/more important people. they spend lots of money to enter an event so they should get first dibs on the water they want to fish. non tourney guys are likely just drinking beer and gettin stoned hopeing to catch one here and there, so they should willingly give up there hot spots. there just gona eat there catch anyway.
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just kidding, Im sure if feels like we think that way sometimes

Mattlures · Post by **Mattlures** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:50 pm

IMO Tournament anglers are the best bass fisherman. They are on average all around better than the recreational anglers. The top tier pros are the best of those tournament Anglers. KVD, IKE, Skeet,etc are the best of the best........But wait. There is a whole other classifacation. The Trophy hunters. I would say the best trophy hunters are equal to the best tournament anglers. So you could have your Butch Brown, Paul Duclos, Siemntal and I would put them up on a leval playing field with the top pros. There is one exception. MR LONG. He screws it up for everybody. He is the best bass fisherman alive. He dominates tournaments and is the king of the trophy hunters. To me winning the classic or any other tournament just isnt that impresive. So you caught 5 small fish. Big whoop. Anybody can do that but how many people on earth have caught multiple bass over 20lbs and probably over 60 better than 15lbs . He also holds or has held just about every lake record in his area. I know the tournament guys are studs, I would just like to see the trophy guys get more credit.

oakview · Post by **oakview** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:24 pm

No...but some guys are good at both...and there are alot of guys that just don't fish tournaments that are sick sticks...A good example is yours truely...I suck in tournaments and I farm fish all day long when fun fishing...HOLLA...

But on a serious note...I think if both Baileys, Todd Holder, Don Osborne, Tim Eaves, either of the Elshere's, Butch Brown or a bunch of others had the backing money wise to go big time(full-time on the FLW, BASS Elite Series, etc...I think they could represent the west coast with the best of them...And win alot of the money...and take over the fishing industry...but like everything if you don't have the money, its hard to show your talent...if thats something you want to do...

And alot us are really good fishermen but when it comes to putting money on the line on a lake we only pre-fished 3days(if that) and still place in the money that takes a real talent...

I guess a better question would be who, that fishes local tournaments or not, would be the most likely to kick@ss in the national series if they had the backing to go bigtime?

Merry X-mas to all my No Cal and So Cal friends
From the redneck with the camera on his head
See you on the water
D.

bassenvy · Post by **bassenvy** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:08 am

the term better in fishing just kills me. There are so many different ways to fish. More productive might be a better term. Then again it really depends on what your objectives are. Your second post Oldschool hit the nail on the head. Guys that fun fish for bigger fish can choose the day/spot etc Guys that are puting money on the line are the best at finding 2-4lb fish and have to sponge all the info they can to prepare for a few days. I've spoken to a few FLW guys and it seems like they've aquired a network over time getting help with spots/lures from a certain group of trusted people. Same goes for big bait fishing some guys share if you give back and don't ruin your reputation.

it's all just fishing with different objectives. I try to do both at my own pace and have fun. Although there are less ego's to worry about when your alone hunting for big fish. Bottom line is people need to have more respect for other fishermen regardless of the price of your boat,the trophys on your wall,or the size fish.

and oh yes Mike Long is Extraterrestrial...why isn't he fishing FLW or BASS? family?

Brock

bassindon69 · Post by **bassindon69** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:12 am

Im with you brother (Brock)
Old School's post put it pretty close to even in a way, that was nice. We are all people with different intrests for sure.
My guess is that Mike L likes to spend more time with his family is all.

Don.

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:23 am

I have fished a few charity tournaments the past decade and fished some early tournaments back in the early 70's, however don't call myself a tourmament fisherman.
Anyone who thinks money can buy you fame as a tournament fisherman simply doesn't understand bass fishing. My personal choice to pursue an Aerospace engineering career instead of bass fishing was the right choice.
My personal best 5 bass limit came at lake Castaic on March 3rd, 1991; 11.3, 15.1, 13.2, 12.0, 17.4 = 69 lbs.
PB at Casitas; 18.8 FLMB on Feb 9th, 1981, LMB; 12.4 in 1971.
PB to date; 19.3 at Castaic, March 5th 1994.
all the above are jig fish.
Best day on the water; Castaic, May 1990, 18 bass over 10 lbs on a modified Scrounger jig w/Sluggo trailer.
I don't beleive there is a tournament bass fisherman that can match those catches. Does that make me a better bass fisherman? No, I can pick my time on the water and not compete with other fisherman.
Tom

Noluk · Post by **Noluk** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:39 am

The answer is kinda yes but it all depends on your perspective and criteria. Boyd Duckett is the clearest example to me. He obviously had the skills to fish at the top level. He chose not too for a long time. I can respect that. I am certain that there are tons of folks who can compete effectively at some tournament level but do not. Time is the biggest factor. Money determines the time available. For some people it is just a hobby.

But I do not think you can take "anyone" give them unlimited time and money and turn them into a tournament winner. These folks who succeed at the top levels have a passion for the sport and a drive to fish. THAT is why they practice 10 hours a day while eating peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and sleeping in the back of their trucks. If you do not have that passion, drive and love then your not going to be able to commit as much of your life to the sport. Would I give up my job and financial security to fish? Heck no. I probably pushed it too hard in some ways already given my rather meager allotment of talent but I still love it. I can, on occasion, cash a check in a local tournament, but live off my earnings. Never. Maybe if I was starting my live over and 15 again i could give it a run but I still doubt that I, or the vast majority of the average fisherman, have what it takes and more importantly are willing to give what it takes to tournament fish for living.

That said, on any given day, most anglers can have a good day. Consistently having a good day, every day that is another story.

bassindon69 · Post by **bassindon69** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:41 am

It's more fun that way Tom

Well, for some it is.
Very nice Jig fish.

Don.

Long Nguyen · Post by **Long Nguyen** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:59 pm

Oldschool wrote: My personal best 5 bass limit came at lake Castaic on March 3rd, 1991; 11.3, 15.1, 13.2, 12.0, 17.4 = 69 lbs.
PB at Casitas; 18.8 FLMB on Feb 9th, 1981, LMB; 12.4 in 1971.
PB to date; 19.3 at Castaic, March 5th 1994.
all the above are jig fish.
Best day on the water; Castaic, May 1990, 18 bass over 10 lbs on a modified Scrounger jig w/Sluggo trailer.

Tom

Whoa....

Ray L. · Post by **Ray L.** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 2:30 pm

Tom
Just a couple of questions for you.
If you have caught fish that big then why are they not on the top 25 list of all time.
The 18.8 would be just out of the top 25.
the 19.3 would be tied for 17th or 18th all time.
I have an old friend who has a fish that size and he is on the list.
Steve Beasley caught his in the mid 80's in San Diego
Why are these great size fish not on the list.
Heck I remember the days at Castaic
I was at the old mini mart when Dan K. weighed his monster
and it was just a bit bigger.
I was also there a second time when Crupi weighed in his first 20 plus pounder.
Hard to believe he caught the second one almost a year to that day.
Anyway I was just wondering about it since those are just monsters and deserve to be on the list.

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 3:16 pm

Steve Beasly caught a 18 lb 10 oz bass january of 81 on a crawdad off the same point I caught the 18 lb 11 oz on a hair jig. Steves killed his, I released mine. Releasing giant bass alive isn't as easy as you would think. I don't if Casitas or Castiac have certifeied scales today, they didn't back then. At Casitas you had to hual the bass to the Corner store, take it not the meat shop and get it weighed, the take it back to the lake to realese it. At Castaic you did a similar trip, except to the Mini Mart and then could release them into the after bay, a little shorter trip. Trying not to over stress the bass, get a photo and release a healthy bass wasn't or isn't an simple task. It's much easier to put the fish on ice.
It's also disappointing when the scales don't go over 22 lbs, you are excited and thinking world record bass and don't think about the top 25, you are just trying to save the fish.
I had a Polariod photo of the 19.3, no certified weight. I posted a photo of the 18 lb 11 oz, Casitas bass on another site.
Tom

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 3:17 pm

Steve Beasly caught a 18 lb 10 oz bass January of 81 on a crawdad off the same point I caught the 18 lb 11 oz on a hair jig. Steves killed his, I released mine. Releasing giant bass alive isn't as easy as you would think. I don't if Casitas or Castiac have certifeied scales today, they didn't back then. At Casitas you had to hual the bass to the Corner store, take it not the meat shop and get it weighed, the take it back to the lake to realese it. At Castaic you did a similar trip, except to the Mini Mart and then could release them into the after bay, a little shorter trip. Trying not to over stress the bass, get a photo and release a healthy bass wasn't or isn't an simple task. It's much easier to put the fish on ice.
It's also disappointing when the scales don't go over 22 lbs, you are excited and thinking world record bass and don't think about the top 25, you are just trying to save the fish.
I had a Polariod photo of the 19.3, no certified weight. I posted a photo of the 18 lb 11 oz, Casitas bass on another site.
Tom

Ray L. · Post by **Ray L.** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:18 pm

OK..... I do know how things were done back then.
Like I said I was there for a couple of those fish.
You caught your fish on Wohlford also. Same point.
I know the spot.
And the fish was 18.8 he caught.
Why is it you have caught 3 fish this size and not 1 is in the top 25 records.
When guys brought there fish to the mini mart the fish were not stressed.
Most guys opened the center cage door in the livewell or they had an airation unit in a large cooler.
So I am still wondering where you weighed your fish.
I guess you weighed them on a spring scale on the water.
Would love to see this pic you posted.
I love shots of the days when I was younger and the really monster fish were in Castaic.
I remember W.O.N. for a while just had monster after monster onthe front cover.
It was a very exciting time to be on Castaic. Fishing was not great for me then but I did catch a couple over 9 pounds during that time.
I was just in my 20's and what a time it was on that lake.
Just to hang at the mini mart after fishing and see who may come in with a 10 to 20 pound fish. What a few years that was in my life.
Oh by the way you are way wrong on the year.
As far as Steve's fish.It was '86 but very close on the month. It was Feb.
You must have been a world record hunter at 1 time. With those size fish under your belt.

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:50 pm

Ray L. wrote:OK..... I do know how things were done back then.
Like I said I was there for a couple of those fish.
You caught your fish on Wohlford also. Same point.
I know the spot.
And the fish was 18.8 he caught.
Why is it you have caught 3 fish this size and not 1 is in the top 25 records.
When guys brought there fish to the mini mart the fish were not stressed.
Most guys opened the center cage door in the livewell or they had an airation unit in a large cooler.
So I am still wondering where you weighed your fish.
I guess you weighed them on a spring scale on the water.
Would love to see this pic you posted.
I love shots of the days when I was younger and the really monster fish were in Castaic.
I remember W.O.N. for a while just had monster after monster onthe front cover.
It was a very exciting time to be on Castaic. Fishing was not great for me then but I did catch a couple over 9 pounds during that time.
I was just in my 20's and what a time it was on that lake.
Just to hang at the mini mart after fishing and see who may come in with a 10 to 20 pound fish. What a few years that was in my life.
Oh by the way you are way wrong on the year.
As far as Steve's fish.It was '86 but very close on the month. It was Feb.
You must have been a world record hunter at 1 time. With those size fish under your belt.

Beasley caught the bass I refered to at Casitas, I'm not wrong about that date. My bass were weighed on meat market scales or my lab scale. The Mini Mart scale was not a certified scale. I had and still have a DO aeration system, however big bass are very susceptable to stress in a live well.
http://www.thebassholes.com/bassin-foru ... pic=1681.0 is the 18 lb 11 oz.
Tom

bassenvy · Post by **bassenvy** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:49 pm

Tom that's a dead link. I'm a member also. post her here please

Oldschool · Post by **Oldschool** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 8:21 am

bassenvy wrote:Tom that's a dead link. I'm a member also. post her here please

It's a free site. Will scan the photo and try to send it next week.
Tom

jsoregon · Post by **jsoregon** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 1:47 am

The beauty of bass fishing is that you can be a weekend angler, co-angler, team tournament angler, or try to make your living fishing (pro or guide). I say you should find whatever is fun to you and do that!

If someone wants to see how good they are then compete and you'll find out real quick...but if not then who cares. Its just fun fishing, you obviously have a day off, so crack open a cold one and just have some fun and relax!!!

If you think you caught a 5lber...then I guess thats your story but who cares if it really was 5lbs or not.

When you compete all "stories" end and the truth is known but if you don't then just enjoy your day off!

"Are tournament anglers better anglers than weekend anglers???" I personally don't really care. Maybe some are, maybe some aren't. If I was a weekend angler I'd just go have fun and forget about competing...

...and if someone really caught and 18lb fish then "nice job". If you killed it then "crappy job and thanks for nothing!".

Joe W. · Post by **Joe W.** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 9:03 am

No, tournament anglers are not better than non tournament anglers. That's just a generalization and it's simply not true. When any dude with money and a boat can enter a tourney as a "Pro" you just can't make a general statement like that.

I do believe the majority of the elite anglers are better than your average weekend warrior, but not all.

AZRANGER · Post by **AZRANGER** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:07 am

JOE W...you are right...I agree 100%...

Mike Phua · Post by **Mike Phua** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:07 am

Why does it matter? There's no venue that exist that could compare the two and if there was..................wouldn't the non tournament fisherman just be another tournament fisherman?

I've got a question? If you non tournament anglers who think your as good or if not better geez I would think money wouldn't have anything to do with it..........cause you'd have plenty from taking all of ours wouldn't you

?

WHAT A JOKE!!!!! MP

some guy · Post by **some guy** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:48 am

PREACH ON PLAYA!

PUT THE CHEDDAR WHERE THE MOUTH IS...ANOTHER POINTLESS WESTERN BASS DEBATE..

Gerryjig · Post by **Gerryjig** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:57 am

LimitedOut wrote:I am both in a club and fish regional tournaments and see a high level of talent from both groups. However I know plenty of guys who can stick it to 'em that just are not interested in the competition factor.

.....fishing is one of the most INDIVIDUAL sports there is. There are guys who have natural ability to always catch as seldom as they may fish and guys of the exact opposite. Some guys with natural ability do fish often and that's a killer combo......he'll be cashing checks while the guy with less natural ability fishing the same amount of time rarely cashes a check. Bottom line......neither is "better". Like all sports, some people hit a "level" and never improve from there......others maintain an open mind and continue to learn and excel....without ever hitting a "ceiling" on their own ability. OH, but the very very best are the guys that fish fresh and salt!

just get out and fish because your sick for it!

Joe W. · Post by **Joe W.** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:59 pm

Mike Phua wrote:Why does it matter? There's no venue that exist that could compare the two and if there was..................wouldn't the non tournament fisherman just be another tournament fisherman?

I've got a question? If you non tournament anglers who think your as good or if not better geez I would think money wouldn't have anything to do with it..........cause you'd have plenty from taking all of ours wouldn't you ?

WHAT A JOKE!!!!! MP

Not everyone wants to fish for money though, that's the point. I'm sure there are plenty of guys who could take your money that have never fished a tourney. I'm not saying it's me, becasue I am no great angler by any means but money isn't all it's about. There are people who fish simply for the love of the sport and you never hear of those guys, but it doesn't make them any less of a great angler.

Ricky-S · Post by **Ricky-S** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:19 pm

fishinman · Post by **fishinman** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:27 pm

Man I remrember those days at castaic. I wasn't into tourneys then , didn't even know they existed. My personal best is 14.7 lbs weighted on a rapala scale at castaic. My best five were well over 35 but not 40lbs. But you guys really brought back memorys of prespawn monster bass in huge groups staging in the backs of coves at castaic that would make any fisherman drool like a starving coyote! I really Miss that. Now I appreciate seeing groups of fish in the backs of coves eating and trapping shad ranging in size of 3-6lbs at castaic. I say kill all the stripers you can but that still wouldn't do any good. Those days are long gone!!!! Now all I can say is we still have the aquairum called castias. Can anybody spare some dynamite. Second thought howbout just a second hand electro shock unit, wouldn't wanna hurt all my little pets!Just like to put my hands on another 14lb. or better bass. What a rush! By the way the first fish I ever caught in a money Tourney (won Bass) weighted 10.20 lbs. Nice weigh to start off!!!!!!!!!!

Mike Phua · Post by **Mike Phua** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:53 pm

There are people who fish simply for the love of the sport and you never hear of those guys, but it doesn't make them any less of a great angler.

You right Joe that's why I said you can't compare the two different kinds of anglers. MP

Brian Linehan · Post by **Brian Linehan** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:04 pm

DL · Post by DL » Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:19 pm

WTF

I could so use a picture of Hippie in a thong right now

g-man · Post by **g-man** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:49 pm

Tourney guys, and non-tourney guys..

well lets see... Most tourney guys spend alot of time on the water finding new water to up their bags. The money is on the line so they put alot of effort into new baits, new spots, etc, etc. Does this make them better then the non-tourney guys? I would have to say as a whole yes. Sure there are plenty of non-tourney guys that can kick butt, or be consistant at the tourney level, but most are just out for fun, and not wanting, or needing to put the time on the water cause they think of fishing as fun, and not for the money, fame, sponsors etc. I'm a tourney guy, and i can tell you right now there are plenty of weekend guys that could kick my butt! You just don't hear as much about those guys as you do the tourney guys! I would like to think with the time I put on the water, and the money i spend on tourneys, tackle, and all the other things that I'm better then the guy that goes out for fun. But the bottom line is there are great fishermen in both...

idahobass · Post by **idahobass** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:44 pm

Brian,

Please leave your wife out of this!!

MIke Gash

Brian Linehan · Post by **Brian Linehan** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:53 pm

Sure Mike, but only if you leave your kids out of the mix.

ash · Post by **ash** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:56 am

Jim Scarlett

Nough Said!

g-man · Post by **g-man** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:01 am

SOCB_Hawghunter wrote:Jim Scarlett

Nough Said!

LMFAO!!!

sTony · Post by **sTony** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:35 am

I think some of the responses have gotten to be pretty laughable.

To use the same logic... there are a ton of guys out there that can whip up on Tiger Woods at golf, they choose not to do so and leave the millions they'd be guaranteed to make if they could do so on the table. Yeah, I believe that, yeah right.

And there are loads of guys out there that would put Tom Brady and Peyton Manning to shame but raising their kids is more important to them.

And I know for a fact there are folks out there that can drive a car far faster then Dale Jr., Gordon, Tony Stewart and all the NASCAR drivers, but their day job was much more important to them. HAHAHAHA.

Seems like a real weird way of looking at the world, don't it?

For me the original question had a simple answer. The top pro's are fishing the BASS Elite Series and/or the FLW Tour or have at least qualified to fish on those tours and there is a light years difference between those anglers and the rest of us. I believe there is a big difference between the folks that dominate local events or your regional pro anglers over the recreational angler also. Darned right I do.

It just blows my mind away how some would want to make everyone seem so average when in truth some folks have skills that truly set them well apart from the crowd.

sTony

Brian Linehan · Post by **Brian Linehan** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:55 am

Great point Tony

Mike Phua · Post by **Mike Phua** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:04 am

Gotta love sTony..................he has a way with words that make you feel like an absolute idiot with out just coming out and saying it.

For you slow ones out there he said.................quit kidding yourself about your neighbor who could whoop KVD on any lake but chooses to collect Hot Wheels for his children. Like I said earlier. WHAT A JOKE!!!!! MP

TEAMDEADMONEY · Post by **TEAMDEADMONEY** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:37 am

on westernbass. Great way to end the year.

I agree with Mike, this topic is a joke.
Saying that Non tournament guys as a whole are as good or better anglers then tournament guys is like saying Phua can pull chicks without having to pay for them..

ahhhh....errrrr...Not gonna happen.

Tournament anglers as a whole are better anglers then nontournament guys because they spend countless hours on the water developing patterns, adjusting to conditions, catching fish, enduring the elements..etc etc.. all while the clock is ticking.
Non tournament guys as a whole dont even bother going out when the conditions are bad, dont adjust to conditions (theres no need to) and the clock isnt running so they arent pressed for time.
If tournament fishing was easy everybody would do it.....the fact is ...tournaments arent easy...its hard to win a tournament..so alot of guys dont bother to put up the cheese to compete...ahhh errr donate. Anybody can go out and catch a fish or two...it takes skill to go out and weigh a nice 5 fish limit.

A few key words here for you slow guys are.."as a whole". Sure there are guys out there that are good anglers that dont fish tournaments, but as a whole, tournament guys are better. PERIOD!!!

Pete

Useless topic

Mike Phua · Post by **Mike Phua** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:55 am

Hey Pete Happy New Year................and by the way your Mama was free!

MP

Joe W. · Post by **Joe W.** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:55 am

sTony wrote:I think some of the responses have gotten to be pretty laughable.

To use the same logic... there are a ton of guys out there that can whip up on Tiger Woods at golf, they choose not to do so and leave the millions they'd be guaranteed to make if they could do so on the table. Yeah, I believe that, yeah right.

And there are loads of guys out there that would put Tom Brady and Peyton Manning to shame but raising their kids is more important to them.

And I know for a fact there are folks out there that can drive a car far faster then Dale Jr., Gordon, Tony Stewart and all the NASCAR drivers, but their day job was much more important to them. HAHAHAHA.

Seems like a real weird way of looking at the world, don't it?

For me the original question had a simple answer. The top pro's are fishing the BASS Elite Series and/or the FLW Tour or have at least qualified to fish on those tours and there is a light years difference between those anglers and the rest of us. I believe there is a big difference between the folks that dominate local events or your regional pro anglers over the recreational angler also. Darned right I do.

It just blows my mind away how some would want to make everyone seem so average when in truth some folks have skills that truly set them well apart from the crowd.

sTony

If you are talking about the Elite series ONLY you have a point, yes they are indeed the best bass fishermen in the world. After that it gets a little cloudy. The day I can show up at a NASCAR event and enter just because I have money and a car is the day I will admit that every "pro" fisherman is better than the weekend guys. The question wasn't "Are the Elite anglers better than non-tournament guys" If it was the answer would be a simple yes. Are ALL tournament anglers better than the weekend guys? Hell no they aren't.

ash · Post by **ash** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:22 am

Joe W. wrote: Are ALL tournament anglers better than the weekend guys? Hell no they aren't.

I agree with you Joe. all that you need is time and $$$ to call yourself a tournament angler. I was living proof of that, my second year fishing I signed up for WON, ABA, and NBW. Now I did cash checks in all three and was Second place in AOY (team tournaments) that year. Today I am 10x's the angler I was when fishing those touranments, and I choose to fish on the Club Level and Rally events. I dont think this makes me less of an angler it has actually allowed me to become a better angler and I know that if I had the resources of time and $$$ I would fish more tournaments.

I do understand that there are different stressors being in a tournament and being a big fish only guy, or a weekend angler. The wonderful thing about this sport and Westernbass is that it encompases the gammit of guys that are passionate about fishing.

Being a "tournament angler" is a lot like being a "tournament poker player" lots of guys are throwing thier money around, lots of guys have won some money or come close to winning, everyone takes themselves wayyyy too seriously and only a few consistantly cash checks.

To me a tournament guy that is getting a 1040 at the end of the year and is actually netting a profit is probably a better angler then the average weekend angler. But the truth is most tournament circuts are compliled of weekend anglers with a gambling problem, and to me that doesnt make them better or more skilled at fishing, just irrisponsible with their resources HAR!

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