AC Colorado River payouts

[Vern]

I usually do not do this but I had a couple of my anglers ask me to post this INFO

49 paid teams $250 full entry including all options
Paid 12 spots (almost 1 in 4)
Total pay back $10460
All anglers were not in all the options

Vern

[Lynne]

Vern,

Those are great payouts. Someday Mike wants to come and fish one of your tournaments at Lake Mead.

Trying to find an open weekend is a hard thing to do as you well know.

Actually your tournament at Lake Havasu in April looks like a good one to fish. Hope to see you there.
Lynne

[jigs]

vern I'm a little confused about your pay backs, you say you had 49 teams pay $250 for the entry fee and options wich if you do the math comes out to $12250 you say you gave out $10460. You also say not every one got in all the options not sure what to believe. If the first statement is correct than where is the other $1790 go that you would have brought in. You also show on the anglers choice website that you are recieving up to $1050 from sponsors if this is true which it probably is then if you deduct that from $10460 then there is only $9410 that was given from entry fees and options. But if your first statement is true about 49 teams paying $250 then you should have $13300 to give out you gave out $10460 where is the other $2800. Now I know theres fees for permits $50 bucks and insurance and toc money but it is hard to believe that it's $2800 worth. Now I'm writing this because all I ever see on this website is how one tournament is better than the other, and if you do the math they are about all the same unless they have people giving them money that offsets the cost, where they can give more out to the fisherman which is great. So if you can clear this up that would be great, but it's hard to think about fishing your tournaments when things don't add up.
But I could be wrong. So if you can clear up this confusion that would be great.

Thanks
Troy Duncan

[Guest]

Troy/Jigs -

Vern isn't exactly gifted on the computer so let me see if I can help.
$250 is "all in" on Vern's events. Some guys didn't get in the options. For all the tournaments I have fished or helped run I have come to conclude 80 percent of the anglers get in the options as a general rule of thumb and it is a pretty good guestimate to do calculations. The regular entry fee is $175. So below is the math.

$175 x 49 = $8575
$75 (Options) x 49 x .80 = $2940

Total entry fees = $11,515

Vern paid back = $10,460

That is a 91% payback.

Now I don't know who was in the options and who wasn't but, calling it 80 percent is about as fair as can be. 100% certainly don't get in them and I doubt if there has ever been a tournament with less than 50 percent of the anglers in the options.

The rest of the money goes to pay for 3 boats and 4 motors for the Southwest TOC's, pay staff (corporate and local) and pay for permits, insurance and supplies (like weigh bags, entry forms, weigh slips, scales etc... etc..)

Typically you will find that AC generally pays back just over 80 percent. So Vern by hustling up sponsors and supporters to kick in to his circuit has raised this to over 90%.

I think this just goes to show (if you didn't already know it) that Vern is one of the best TD's anywhere.

NOTE: Most orgs pay 80% or less in their paybacks.
NOTE 2: Exception is 100% bass which pays back 100% of "entry fees".

Whatever org you fish - do the math yourself - calculate the total entry fee by figuring 80% of the anglers are in the options and then decide where you want to fish. If you don't think it's 80% use 50% or 30% but, it's pretty consistent across all the orgs for guys who get in the options!

By no means am I saying one org is any better than any other org - In fact, I am telling you to do your own evaluation, it's pretty easy. However, I know there are those of you who blast anything that makes any kind of sense - so feel free to blast away - I get on this site once a week these days (at most) so if I don't respond you'll know why.

[Brian Linehan]

100% BASS pays 100% of entry fees and 100% of options to be correct Tom

Rocky did a great job out here at DVL Tom. We just need more guys!

[Vern]

Troy you are right I did make a mistake in my orignal post I said that I had 49 teams pay the $250 entry counting options then said that not all were not in the options. Yes I did make a mistake. I also said that I do not usually do this. You are one of the main reasons that I don't and will not do it again. Like the tournament circuit that you fish does.
Now to clear up a few facts where on the web site does it mention $1050 in sponsor money???
It States that there will be a $300 bonous for the big fish at each tournament and $1200 bouous at the last tournament. Get your facts straight.
As for permits get your facts straight again I payed $200 per permit, if you do not believe this check with Tony from fish and game or come over hear and I will show them to you.
Not like some directors my books are open to any angler that fishes my tournaments.

Now you want some figures hear they are the tournaments that you fish (your Dads) can not touch them.

Feb 9 Mead tournament total take in counting options and entry fees $11990 Total pay back $10460 that is alittle over 87% pay back. I know the circuit you fish does not get close to that.

As for the sponsor money yes there is a lot of it it is paid out in equal payouts at each tournament.
Also so you will know I had 49 teams pay that fished I put in a basic entry fee out of my pocket to make it 50 teams which paid an extra spot.
As I said with 49 teams that actually fished I paid 12 spots that is almost 1 in 4.

My suggestion to you if you want to see my books come fish one of my tournaments. Come fish where the big boys fish. Vern

[N.A.R]

Tom that pretty much summed it up for me. Good Job of making it completely clear.

Brain hang in there with 100% the numbers will go up next year. My team partner and I will be fishing your events next year. As will quite a few anglers from San Diego as they will be closing San V in the middle of July.

[jigs]

Vern Vern Vern

Well let start off by saying this wasn't a directed attack on you. It was that the numbers didn't make since. As for my facts being straight your news section on your result page shows it right there so unless you change it, it's right there in black and white. $300 from the electrical company $500 from bassproshops for the winning team or highest team from sign ups at basspro shops plus $250 for the team first out of the money from bass proshops. so unless thats not true then you made a mistake on your news section. If you add that up that $1050 in sponser money wich is great, But the numbers show your money based on entry fees and options $11990 and gave away $10460 wich is great that means $1530 for permits and stuff. the problem I see is that of the $10460, 1050 of that is sponser money(which is great) so if you do the math and subtract out 1050 from 10460 it gives you$9410 from the entry fees not 10460, which leaves $2580 of entry fee and option money going towards permits and other stuff seems like alot. The point I'm making is that you make sound so good to everybody ( wich it is pretty good ) but that $2580 seems like alot for all of those extra things.

Man If Brian was to get that amount of boats then he would be giving 100% back on fees and options.

Now Vern I'm not saying your tournaments are bad or anything just the numbers didn't make sense and maybe thats why you never posted them before. Not sure.

As for the comment come play with the big boys in your region. Well Iv'e fished against them before and had no problems. I gues seven angler of the year titles against some of your fisherman wasn't good enough. Also your attacks against my dad was uncalled for. My statement wasn't against you it was against the numbers.


thanks for your time Vern
Troy

[Vern]

First Troy I did not attack your dad he is a class act. All I said that you fished your dads circuit.
Second as for fishing against the big boys that was a challenge and also said if you do you could see my records.
You and Danny have done something that will probably never be matched 7 Anglers of the year is out standing.
When your dad or any other director post their payouts I have never seen any one come on line and bash them.
So yes I took it as a direct insult. and still do
I forgot about the news section at this tournament I did give out $1050 in sponsor money you are correct. Guess what at the next tournament it will be more as I have another sponsor.
Now for you statment about the $2580 you say it sounds like a lot of money. Well guess what I have a letter in my hand that your dad passed out at his tournament giving the anglers a complete break down of where the money went.
There is know way that you can deny what I am going to put on you. If your dad had 50 Boats which I had his money that would be held out would be $2500 yes that is right $2500.
Let me see now I held out $2580 that is $80 more that your Dads circuit. The only difference is that I pay back 87%.
If you have anyother questions feel free to call me as this fourm has enough drama.
Hope that you and Danny can again win Angler of the year .

P.S. Larry this post has know reflections against you, as we all know a directors job is thankless and you run a great tournament. Vern

[Guest]

Sorry Bryan.... That is what I meant!

[LV Ba$$]

Vern-

YOU DA MAN!!

Every aspect of how you run your tournaments is :

"FOR THE ANGLERS"

I can attest to that as you have treated Gerry and I with nothing but respect, honesty and class. You are always willing to go the extra mile and in any business fortitude is a rare quality.

You have dont great things for this circuit, KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!

I could care less what is here or there, Im this or that. All I want to do is fish and hopefully get my money back a little thicker than I gave it to you.

Thanks for all you do!
-David Zachgo