West Coast or AC .....LOL

[BMX Bassin]

Would you rather fish for 10lbrs and a Harley or 2lb spots?I will be fishing for Hogs and a Hog at the West Coast Clearlake. Not sure how long this will stay up considering this is an Anglers choice owned site. Just wish we didnt have to choose

[Bill Cook]

Mike- Bass fishing is all about choices, you have the option to go to the lake you enjoy the most and fish with an organization you believe in. The fact that anglers have to choose between the two organizations this year is very disappointing and will not be repeated next year. All I can promise is that we will put on a first class event and that anglers will know exactly what they are fishing for and how much money each place will pay BEFORE they launch on day one. Every angler will be treated fairly and we will appreciate each and every person who comes to our event.

Thanks for reading this and we hope to see you at a US Anglers Choice event this year.

Bill Cook
USAC Pro-Am Tournament Director
661-319-3014

[N.A.R]

Bill I do believe I can find a post stating that you will have a stand alone event, for the southern part of the state. .....

Tony Richards

[Bill Cook]

Tony- we are working on it. We lost the date we were planning on. We are also working on a full slate for the 2010-2011 season.

Thanks for your interest.

Bill

[Gary Dobyns]

This has been a question running around a lot. First off Oroville because of the spots will fish far better than Clear Lake. If we a don't get a big move from those largies at Clear Lake, it can be very tough bite. I have fished there in Feb when more than half the field blanked. That said, if there was not a conflict I would be there.

Here are the positives for Anglers Choice.

AC had decent fields last year and have a great bonus for the anglers that fish them all. They are trying to get guys to follow and NOT just fish their home lake. This is to try and build numbers so we have decent sized events again.

AC pays 100%

An advisory board baically sets all the ground work. They do not run the events BUT are used in all decisions. They also see the $$ numbers and know who is in what options and all pay outs.

AC has many things in the works. They will be announced as completed.

Larry Viv is a friend of mine. He has some hurdles to jump re-starting WCB. I will try and fish the one non-conflict date he has. He has sponsor backing this year, but none of us know how it's going to work or the extent of it. I know he plans on 12 TV shows over the year. I personally don't like catering to one body of water and Larry is doing that. Larry needs an advisory board to help with decisions and he needs to listen to the guys. With WCB before, he did not listen. Tournament fishing has changed a lot since he folded WCB. Larry told me at ISE in Sac that he could now make WCB as big as anything in the East (with his new sponsors) I think it would be GREAT for us anglers if he pulled this off. I wish him all the luck in the world, but he is the "new" show and will have to prove it.

Personally, if I was in Larry's shoes I would of pulled back and re-grouped with the addition of these NEW sponsors. I'd get off the conflict dates so anglers do not have to choose. This is my opinion only and it's Larry's decision to make. As a new circuit, I would want all the anglers I could get.

AC is established and did all they promised last year, have a better schedule, a better payback, an advisory board that's listened to and shown the books, a publication, and many new things in the works.

As a fisherman, I have to choose because of the schedules. I told Larry at San Mateo, "don't be mad at the anglers because we have to make a choice".

Yes I am working with AC, because I was asked, I know what's going on and how things will work. I am comfortable with this because I am one of 15 or so on their advisory board helping with all decisions.

Also BMX, 2 pound spots are NOT going to win

[Rick G]

Lets see.
52 weeks in a year.
less 7 holiday weekends a year.
that leaves 45 weekends left. Right............?
Than why in the he&*%$ cant these guys have seperate events? I Just wish for once these Org's would do the RIGHT THING for the sport and all get along and not beat the crap out of eachother and help this sport get stronger. Put all your GIANT ego's aside and let these events stand alone get good turnouts. Face it, all these org's are digging for the FLW scraps to be "The best weekend trail". The thing is, " they could all kick ***" with a little communication and planning. Spread-em out and let the anglers decide what they can afford and who they like. Forcing them to make a choice is bad business IMHO. And BTW, this does not include team events, but we all know there are WAY too many of those Org's. Rick G.

[BMX Bassin]

The potential at Clear lake with this wek or 2 of more stable warmer weather might make it off the hook. And yes Gary, your right 2 lb spots wont win . Just voicing my dipapproval of 2 events on the same day. And I know the new AC TD's are outstanding at what they do.

[sTony]

Lets see.
52 weeks in a year.
less 7 holiday weekends a year.
that leaves 45 weekends left. Right............? Rick G.

That's over simplifying it a bit. There are other obstacles that these guys face beyond 7 holiday weekends a year. There are other dates that would be in conflict; such as the annual Clear Lake tourney now called the Holder Ford, US OPEN, the Berkley Big Bass tourney, the SnagProof, not to mention all those team championships that so many Pros and Ams also qualify to fish. I'm thinking that pre-fish for tournaments also keeps people away from fishing as aggressively as your post indicates.

The cost of fishing competitively and the rough economy also play a huge factor - now more then ever. No matter how much future cooperation these folks have with each other, there will likely always be choices to make. And to a degree it's healthy and needed. I think most agree that there might be too many choices right now, but it is the nature of living in a capitalist society and one where there are no boundaries, guidelines or restrictions as to how these organizations operate. Anyone can pull an event permit from the DFG. They don't have to have a track record, they don't have to have minimum level requirements for things such as bump tanks, water troughs or release elements. No minimum standard for participation either. Even the DFG permits have little to no monitoring once granted beyond a post-event report.

Now, that being said, you were dead on the head of the nail with everything else in your post Rick. There is little cooperation going on and has been the case for a long time. The game is being run now by folks that are all in an adversarial mode. Not much chance of accomplishing anything for themselves or their anglers as long as this is the case. Right now there isn't a general plan, no collective vision and little shared communications.

sTony

[Rick G]

Lets see.
52 weeks in a year.
less 7 holiday weekends a year.
that leaves 45 weekends left. Right............? Rick G.

That's over simplifying it a bit. There are other obstacles that these guys face beyond 7 holiday weekends a year. There are other dates that would be in conflict; such as the annual Clear Lake tourney now called the Holder Ford, US OPEN, the Berkley Big Bass tourney, the SnagProof, not to mention all those team championships that so many Pros and Ams also qualify to fish. I'm thinking that pre-fish for tournaments also keeps people away from fishing as aggressively as your post indicates.

The cost of fishing competitively and the rough economy also play a huge factor - now more then ever. No matter how much future cooperation these folks have with each other, there will likely always be choices to make. And to a degree it's healthy and needed. I think most agree that there might be too many choices right now, but it is the nature of living in a capitalist society and one where there are no boundaries, guidelines or restrictions as to how these organizations operate. Anyone can pull an event permit from the DFG. They don't have to have a track record, they don't have to have minimum level requirements for things such as bump tanks, water troughs or release elements. No minimum standard for participation either. Even the DFG permits have little to no monitoring once granted beyond a post-event report.

Now, that being said, you were dead on the head of the nail with everything else in your post Rick. There is little cooperation going on and has been the case for a long time. The game is being run now by folks that are all in an adversarial mode. Not much chance of accomplishing anything for themselves or their anglers as long as this is the case. Right now there isn't a general plan, no collective vision and little shared communications.

sTony

Well Tony, as you know most org's want to fish from Feb-the end of June. [26 weeks]. Take out Easter and Memorial day leaves 24. There are 3 Pro/Am org's now that can divide those up for what, 3-4 events each. Looks like plenty of room to me. Have a lottery or a draft like little league to see who gets the best dates? Gotta be a solution. Rick G.

[Gary Dobyns]

Rick you touched on a good subject. TOO MANY team events. Each circuit having individual lake region kills everyone's numbers. The circuits are the ones that have screwed this up and they need to get together and FIX it before someone steps in and fixes it for them. Can you imagine if a state rule gets imposed like other states have about " YOU CANNOT HAVE A TOUNAMENT ON THE SAME BODY OF WATER ON CONSECITIVE WEEKS"!!! All the circuits are guilty here. The question I ask, wouldn't you rather have bigger events and less events?

Circuit owners here is what happens a lot:

A fisherman thinks, I probably ought to go to _____ but heck they will only draw 20 boats and I have to catch a BIG one or I won't get one of the 3 or 4 checks. Heck that's not worth it, I'll just go fun fishing the bites better over at ____ anyway, OR Heck I'll go watch the game instead, OR heck why fish because ____, or ____, or____ will probably win, they fish the lake 4 days a week and that don't leave me much of a chance to get a check. So now you are losing anglers simply because of numbers. The one lake wonders sit at home and are tough to beat, so your numbers go down even farther. The Future Pro thing also adds to the demise of numbers, BUT they throw less events and make their guys travel. Therefore they have better numbers. Better numbers actually build numbers. The circuit that gets this going RIGHT will win the support of the fishermen.

Something needs to change here and the circuits are the ones that screwed it up and they are the only ones that can FIX IT!!

[sTony]

Also note that it's not just a hand full of orgs pulling permits.

You have sometimes more then 50 entities pulling permits at the Sacramento DFG Jamboree. They are all in conflict with each other on some level. And that doesn't count a single club level permit. There are how many clubs using annual permits. These are also not monitored in any fashion. They are also in some ways in competition, certainly for fishable water on those lakes when clubs are also running events same day as event permit holders. But also in how many anglers come to fish as both pros and ams as they are also members of clubs in many cases.

There are so many things that impact any orgs draw. None of it is being scrutinized or regulated. Not by government thankfully, and not by the org or the anglers themselves regrettably.

sTony

[sTony]

Well Tony, as you know most org's want to fish from Feb-the end of June. [26 weeks]. Take out Easter and Memorial day leaves 24. There are 3 Pro/Am org's now that can divide those up for what, 3-4 events each. Looks like plenty of room to me. Have a lottery or a draft like little league to see who gets the best dates? Gotta be a solution. Rick G.

There are possible solutions. Certainly. But who's actively seeking them out right now? There's the problem. I'd also suggest that there are more then three orgs in competition for basically the same anglers right now even if only because many of the anglers fish on several levels of competition. Lots of pro anglers fish as teams as well. Many also fish the specialty tournaments that are out there. The compression of the pro/am season is surely regrettable also as it does tend to put the orgs all rushing for the same dates even if not at the same location.


sTony

[Gary Dobyns]

I agree with you Tony, BUT they better get ready for F&G to impose some guide lines for tanks, and bump tanks. I chatted with several F&G guys at ISE Sac. Some of the weigh ins are terrible.

Everyone should note. F&G is really on OUR SIDE for tournaments. They are a bunch of good guys. I don't agree with some of their decisions BUT they are trying to provide a FIX for issues and sometimes that fix works against something else. ( like the 5 pound per bag rule this year). Please understand these guys have fished tournaments themselves and they are OUR FRIENDS.

I think we all agree this state is screwed up and we have powerful organizations would like to see fishing go away. Tournaments being first on the list. We should be VERY THANKFUL that the boys heading up F&G in Sac are FRIENDS to us.

[sTony]

The circuit that gets this going RIGHT will win the support of the fishermen. Something needs to change here and the circuits are the ones that screwed it up and they are the only ones that can FIX IT!!

I'm not convinced that getting it right equates to unanimous support. Over the years some of these orgs might have gotten it 'right' at one time or another but didn't garner the support to sustain it. That's only part of why I'd suggest that it's never just the circuits that can fix things. It has to be a cooperative effort between the orgs and the anglers. Can't work any other way. It hasn't to date.

sTony

[sTony]

I agree with you Tony, BUT they better get ready for F&G to impose some guide lines for tanks, and bump tanks. I chatted with several F&G guys at ISE Sac. Some of the weigh ins are terrible.

Everyone should note. F&G is really on OUR SIDE for tournaments. They are a bunch of good guys. I don't agree with some of their decisions BUT they are trying to provide a FIX for issues and sometimes that fix works against something else. ( like the 5 pound per bag rule this year). Please understand these guys have fished tournaments themselves and they are OUR FRIENDS.

I think we all agree this state is screwed up and we have powerful organizations would like to see fishing go away. Tournaments being first on the list. We should be VERY THANKFUL that the boys heading up F&G in Sac are FRIENDS to us.

It would have been nice to have regulated ourselves but if DFG steps up I'd be in full support of it. I'm not knocking DFG at all, they do a great job given the political system they work within. And the biologists are amongst the best you'll find anywhere and thankfully, so many of them are bass anglers as well. We're very fortunate for that.

sTony

[Gary Dobyns]

[quote="sTony"][quote="Gary Dobyns"]The circuit that gets this going RIGHT will win the support of the fishermen. Something needs to change here and the circuits are the ones that screwed it up and they are the only ones that can FIX IT!![/quote]

I'm not convinced that getting it right equates to unanimous support. Over the years some of these orgs might have gotten it 'right' at one time or another but didn't garner the support to sustain it. That's only part of why I'd suggest that it's never just the circuits that can fix things. It has to be a cooperative effort between the orgs and the anglers. Can't work any other way. It hasn't to date.

sTony[/quote]

You are right of course, BUT I should of said it has to start with the ORGS. They need to make the first move. The only way the fishermen can start the change would be to ORGANIZE! If I really thought that would work, I'd of tried it already. Can you imagine if the fishermen could tell the orgs what to do or "We won't be there"!! This would never work but if enough guys think it would, I'd be all for it

[flipit]

Rick you touched on a good subject. TOO MANY team events. Each circuit having individual lake region kills everyone's numbers. The circuits are the ones that have screwed this up and they need to get together and FIX it before someone steps in and fixes it for them. C The question I ask, wouldn't you rather have bigger events and less events?

Circuit owners here is what happens a lot:

A fisherman thinks, I probably ought to go to _____ but heck they will only draw 20 boats and I have to catch a BIG one or I won't get one of the 3 or 4 checks. Heck that's not worth it, I'll just go fun fishing the bites better over at ____ anyway, OR Heck I'll go watch the game instead, OR heck why fish because ____, or ____, or____ will probably win, they fish the lake 4 days a week and that don't leave me much of a chance to get a check. So now you are losing anglers simply because of numbers. The one lake wonders sit at home and are tough to beat, so your numbers go down even farther. The Future Pro thing also adds to the demise of numbers, BUT they throw less events and make their guys travel. Therefore they have better numbers. Better numbers actually build numbers. The circuit that gets this going RIGHT will win the support of the fishermen.

Something needs to change here and the circuits are the ones that screwed it up and they are the only ones that can FIX IT!!

I believe here in lies the solution, rid of one body regions(Delta, Oroville, Clear Lake and so on)The circuits that are drawing numbers are the rookie leagues. Most fish at least 3 bodies of water. Id prefer they go even further and make it 5-7 depending on the number of tourneys. Fewr tourneys and ridding of the one lake/body format would draw larger fields.

Ill be fishing AC, and I can tell you from recent prefish that I would not be suprised to see some 20lb bags weighed at Oroville.

[sTony]

You are right of course, BUT I should of said it has to start with the ORGS. They need to make the first move. The only way the fishermen can start the change would be to ORGANIZE! If I really thought that would work, I'd of tried it already. Can you imagine if the fishermen could tell the orgs what to do or "We won't be there"!! This would never work but if enough guys think it would, I'd be all for it

My notion would be that both orgs and anglers need to organize to some degree. That's how it works in most sports. You have some of that happening on the other side of the country with the PAA and NPAA and what have you. But nothing on this side of the country and nothing at the org level.

Where would baseball, football, basketball and so forth be without the organization breakdowns that they have. Tennis and golf also. Players associations and owners that work both work in collectives.

sTony

[Ricky-S]

All great points. I am just glad that we can have a conversation about the situation without anyone taking things personal.

I think that WCB, AC, and WB all need to go out to dinner and agree NOT to hold tournaments on the SAME DAY. PERIOD end of story. Can't be that hard to do UNLESS someone lets their ego get in the way.

In the past I was able to fish WON, AC, and WCB with ZERO problems. I also think that EVERY TD should fish a FLW or BASS as a co-angler and see how a tournament SHOULD be run. Some of these Pro/Ams are using technology and approaches that is very outdated.

We also need to stop holding all the tournaments in the SPRING. The Snag Proof open draws great numbers in the summer and what about a October or November tournament. Most of the events are stacked up in a 4-5 month period. January at Oroville or Shasta would yeild great fishing.

Lastly, until the anglers OWN the circuit, the owners will NEVER make decisions that are in the BEST interest of the ANGLERS!

[Rick G]

The boat shows down here are alot like the org's. Too many and the attendance stinks[except fred hall lbeach]. But they dont want to cancel them because they are afraid some one else is going to come along and take those dates and put on another show! There is no more dealers than usual [few left]. So lets have lots of poorly attended shows. Stupid. The org's have to police themselves FOR THE GOOD OF THE SPORT AND A HEALTY FUTURE. Maybe this is what they need.
1-Let FLW pick their dates and there can be NO changes no matter the conditions. 24weeks-3 and they get 1 fall date. That leaves 21 dates left.
2-Have a serpentene draft for the rest of the org's. 1,2,3 {won,a/c,wcb]. Pick a straw for who goes first. The order goes like this, 1-2-3-3-2-1 untill the dates are full. If each gets 4 dates that still leaves 9 weeks to spread them out between each other and have some room for specialty events and team derbys. And that is just using the Feb-June 31st time table. Mr Dobyns is right! Only the org's can correct the problem. Heck, I dont even fish up there and I think it stinks. Rick G.

[Bill Cook]

A couple of points I would like to make:

1)" I also think that EVERY TD should fish a FLW or BASS as a co-angler and see how a tournament SHOULD be run. Some of these Pro/Ams are using technology and approaches that is very outdated." Amen. I suggested this to WON 3 years ago. I'll go one step further, this is how every org HAS to be. Watch what we do.

2) "Let FLW pick their dates and there can be NO changes no matter the conditions. 24weeks-3 and they get 1 fall date." FLW always gives us their dates in advance, we set our schedules, then they change theirs and we all scramble. All we can do is communicate between the 3 western orgs and strive to provide the best schedule possible, understanding that it won't be perfect. We are already working on next seasons schedules and will provide that info to WCB and WON when we are done. After that, we will be flexible. We also have to publish these proposed schedules BEORE the DFG Jamboree in order to give everyone else a chance to schedule their dates around them. It does not do us any good to agree between the 3 orgs and then lose the date to a club or team event.

An org will never get it right until they understand that we are here for the anglers. Without them, nothing good happens.

Fish AC, fish WCB, fish WON, please just fish.

Bill Cook

[Rick G]

There needs to be a Tournament Czar. The org's will never do what is right for the fishermen because all they are interested in is their own success. Sorry for being blunt, but looking at it from the sidelines for 30 years, this is what I see. FLW/BASS, then Pro-ams, then team events, then specialty events, then club......that should be the priority pecking order for the permit process. Why FLW/BASS first? Because they stand the best chance for promotion of the sport and the State/Cities/Business's that keep the economy related to our sport flowing. If were not growing we are going backwards. Rick G.

[JamesH]

There needs to be a Tournament Czar. The org's will never do what is right for the fishermen because all they are interested in is their own success. Sorry for being blunt, but looking at it from the sidelines for 30 years, this is what I see. FLW/BASS, then Pro-ams, then team events, then specialty events, then club......that should be the priority pecking order for the permit process. Why FLW/BASS first? Because they stand the best chance for promotion of the sport and the State/Cities/Business's that keep the economy related to our sport flowing. If were not growing we are going backwards. Rick G.

Wow that sounds a great Communist plan to me. Hell maybe the DF&G should just take over all of the private organizations so that they can make the tournament process "Fair for All". Yea, that's it let have all tournaments run by the State for the good of the people....

James

[N.A.R]

Advisory Board?Why?

Why not ask your customers? Who do you want to please the 4 or 5 guys sitting in the closed door meeting with you?

Why not use the partner pairings to get a census of what the Anglers/Customers want? Then sit back and make the decisions that is best for YOUR company.

If that was the case we might of kept our Weekend Pro Ams um err on the Weekend? Saturday and Sunday!

Tony

[TAP25]

AC for me! There is only 2 that i would fish and they are both listed. I choose AC for these reasons:
1.New Tourney Staff who are true professionals when it comes to running a tourney Pro Am. (Sorry never fished WCB but I do hear good things)
2. Cash payback I dont want a harley or a boat that can not be sold for the value you win it for and I like the open book policy!
3.I have been a Stren fisherman for last 2 years and with no Stren now I want to fish a Circuit with good locations and dates and a rewarding Championship at the end which who qualifies fishes for MORE CASH!
4.With bad economic times I would be scared to spend my money with certian organizations just to have them quit on us like the Strens out west. Just like a lot of you I spent a lot of time, energy,and MONEY with the Strens just to watch it go away. I feel comfortable with AC for the 1 reason that they are a large Organization and will be here to stay.
5.I like the names on the Advisory Board I know they will do everything they can to make these events fun and fair for the Fisherman!

Good Luck to everyone where ever you will be fishing!!!

Tony Peterson

[Gary Dobyns]

Why an advisory board? Here are a few reasons.

Because in the past there have been CROOKS running tournaments.

Terrible decisions like Won bass did in their Pro-Ams last year.

New ideas.

To give fishermen a voice, and let the orgs know what "we" as customers want.

To help with things so it's not a buddy system.

To help with setting rules, ideas for and against off limit periods, protests, ect...

AC has about 15 guys, flat not sure on the count. There are Pro and Am's on this. Out of the 15, you as an angler probably know one, or several. This is a great way to get your voice heard. We are there to help anglers and the organization so EVERYONE wins.

Just my opinion.

[Rick G]

There needs to be a Tournament Czar. The org's will never do what is right for the fishermen because all they are interested in is their own success. Sorry for being blunt, but looking at it from the sidelines for 30 years, this is what I see. FLW/BASS, then Pro-ams, then team events, then specialty events, then club......that should be the priority pecking order for the permit process. Why FLW/BASS first? Because they stand the best chance for promotion of the sport and the State/Cities/Business's that keep the economy related to our sport flowing. If were not growing we are going backwards. Rick G.

Wow that sounds a great Communist plan to me. Hell maybe the DF&G should just take over all of the private organizations so that they can make the tournament process "Fair for All". Yea, that's it let have all tournaments run by the State for the good of the people....

Not saying it has to be a State employee or anyone connected with DFG. Heck, make it someone who has nothing to gain but what is best for the sport. No politics, no backdoor deals. Just what is best and watch things get better. Rick G.

James

[Gary Dobyns]

[quote="Rick G"]There needs to be a Tournament Czar. The org's will never do what is right for the fishermen because all they are interested in is their own success. Sorry for being blunt, but looking at it from the sidelines for 30 years, this is what I see. FLW/BASS, then Pro-ams, then team events, then specialty events, then club......that should be the priority pecking order for the permit process. Why FLW/BASS first? Because they stand the best chance for promotion of the sport and the State/Cities/Business's that keep the economy related to our sport flowing. If were not growing we are going backwards. Rick G.[/quote]

LOTS of truth here. I am the last guy that wants more goverment and/or anyone telling me how to do it. Soooooo, let's fix this on our own. Anyone that does not see a problem as it exists is an IDIOT!! It is getting WORSE every year. We need to fix this ourselves before someone fixes it in a way we ALL don't like. Simple? Hell no. Can it be fixed? I'm not sure, but would like to see it tried. How about a meeting with all orgs, F&G, sponsors, and fishermen? I am dead serious!!!!!! This could be the start. I have already spoke to several orgs about this and they all said they would particitate.

[stickbait]

Would you rather fish for 10lbrs and a Harley or 2lb spots?I will be fishing for Hogs and a Hog at the West Coast Clearlake. Not sure how long this will stay up considering this is an Anglers choice owned site. Just wish we didnt have to choose

I really don't think it should be about the size of the fish or how good the bite is for that matter ....

I would fish for 2 lbers all day if the money was good.. who cares how big the fish are..

You can get your *** whipped at clearlake catching 5 good ones just as easy.. when the bite is good, it is good for everyone..

It should be about the size of the check and what the org. has to offer the angler in making this decision.

If your a pro fishermen (or think you are) ya got to do... what ya got to do..

Though I am not fishing any more this issue has gone on forever..

All orgs are wanting the sweet spots on the dates, hoping to pull the most anglers to their events and in doing so they make anglers choose ..and then we have big pizzn matches

Seems to me it would be best if the Jamboree (or someone) would make everyone pick a date out of the sweet time frame, i.e one date in the middle of summer or winter.. or a friday/saturday event....it would open up more dates for sure....IMO

Someone is going to have to take this bull by the horns someday and get it sorted out.......

carry on boys..

[BMX Bassin]

Would you rather fish for 10lbrs and a Harley or 2lb spots?I will be fishing for Hogs and a Hog at the West Coast Clearlake. Not sure how long this will stay up considering this is an Anglers choice owned site. Just wish we didnt have to choose

I really don't think it should be about the size of the fish or how good the bite is for that matter ....

I would fish for 2 lbers all day if the money was good.. who cares how big the fish are..

You can get your *** whipped at clearlake catching 5 good ones just as easy.. when the bite is good, it is good for everyone..

It should be about the size of the check and what the org. has to offer the angler in making this decision.

If your a pro fishermen (or think you are) ya got to do... what ya got to do..

Though I am not fishing any more this issue has gone on forever..

All orgs are wanting the sweet spots on the dates, hoping to pull the most anglers to their events and in doing so they make anglers choose ..and then we have big pizzn matches

Seems to me it would be best if the Jamboree (or someone) would make everyone pick a date out of the sweet time frame, i.e one date in the middle of summer or winter.. or a friday/saturday event....it would open up more dates for sure....IMO

Someone is going to have to take this bull by the horns someday and get it sorted out.......

carry on boys..

My point sticky was, Both Orgs seem to have good payback. AC is 100% payback but will have less turn out(from polls on sites I have seen) and West Coast is 90% but throw the harley on top and its over 110% payback.
So it comes down to where do you want to fish?
I want to fish Clear Lake. My choice.
But like I said I wish I didnt have to choose.
carry on Stick

[stickbait]

Would you rather fish for 10lbrs and a Harley or 2lb spots?I will be fishing for Hogs and a Hog at the West Coast Clearlake. Not sure how long this will stay up considering this is an Anglers choice owned site. Just wish we didnt have to choose

I really don't think it should be about the size of the fish or how good the bite is for that matter ....

I would fish for 2 lbers all day if the money was good.. who cares how big the fish are..

You can get your *** whipped at clearlake catching 5 good ones just as easy.. when the bite is good, it is good for everyone..

It should be about the size of the check and what the org. has to offer the angler in making this decision.

If your a pro fishermen (or think you are) ya got to do... what ya got to do..

Though I am not fishing any more this issue has gone on forever..

All orgs are wanting the sweet spots on the dates, hoping to pull the most anglers to their events and in doing so they make anglers choose ..and then we have big pizzn matches

Seems to me it would be best if the Jamboree (or someone) would make everyone pick a date out of the sweet time frame, i.e one date in the middle of summer or winter.. or a friday/saturday event....it would open up more dates for sure....IMO

Someone is going to have to take this bull by the horns someday and get it sorted out.......

carry on boys..

My point sticky was, Both Orgs seem to have good payback. AC is 100% payback but will have less turn out(from polls on sites I have seen) and West Coast is 90% but throw the harley on top and its over 110% payback.
So it comes down to where do you want to fish?
I want to fish Clear Lake. My choice.
But like I said I wish I didnt have to choose.
carry on Stick

I thought your point was, what would you rather fish for 10lbers or 2 lbers.. but then after reading it .. it seems like a pot stiring post anyway...

Would you rather fish for 10lbrs and a Harley or 2lb spots?I will be fishing for Hogs and a Hog at the West Coast Clearlake. Not sure how long this will stay up considering this is an Anglers choice owned site. Just wish we didnt have to choose

[Maackbass]

First off I agree with "no more government" control, robbery, blind leading the blind or whatever you want to call it.

Eventually a tournament organization is going to thrive out here in the west. We have the worldclass fisheries, our own resources, and with a little time and work I think that will shine through in an organization. As a co-angler from hell that didn't make it off the waiting list for the FLW I'm exploring my other options. The fact AC has a great schedule and some sponsors/endorsements that really support the idea of pro/am configurations, makes the decision easy for me. Hope to see everyone at Oroville!!

[pitchin1]

You guys really don't know just how good you have it. Tournaments numbers here have dropped to nearly nothing. A word of advice, if you don't want this to happen in your area support the tried, tested and proven events and don't jump into every new thing to roll into town.

This is one month on one lake in MO. note the arrows at the bottom of the page. You can go to the ramp and pick from 3 or 4 different events on many days.
http://www.mswp.dps.mo.gov/Regattas/Reg ... tta=Search

SUPPORT ESTABLISHED EVENTS. Good Luck to you!

[longshot]

I personally am not going to fish Orgs that have tournaments at one lake ESP. if they have "wondering" or "traveling" ect. It just allows guys to sit on there lake and wait for the money to stop off at there door steps.
I feel that this is what is killing the GAME we all play. What makes future pro and the WRL inviting is they have div. that never hit the same lakes twice (except TOC) Ya there will be cherry pickers and home field advantage but eventually you get your lake. It all washes out in the end.
This year I am going to fish the fun events to me..... snag proof, holder ect. and wait for the Orgs to figure it out or fall apart. I truelly miss fishing team circuits but its just not worth it at this time.
L.S.
P.S.
Making a TOC is as easy as fishing -5 events and weighing one fish in each SAD make it top 100 MAX or less. I know that more is better for sponsers but really its a JOKE.

[Gary Dobyns]

[quote="longshot"]I personally am not going to fish Orgs that have tournaments at one lake ESP. if they have "wondering" or "traveling" ect. It just allows guys to sit on there lake and wait for the money to stop off at there door steps.
I feel that this is what is killing the GAME we all play. What makes future pro and the WRL inviting is they have div. that never hit the same lakes twice (except TOC) Ya there will be cherry pickers and home field advantage but eventually you get your lake. It all washes out in the end.
This year I am going to fish the fun events to me..... snag proof, holder ect. and wait for the Orgs to figure it out or fall apart. I truelly miss fishing team circuits but its just not worth it at this time.
L.S.
P.S.
Making a TOC is as easy as fishing -5 events and weighing one fish in each SAD make it top 100 MAX or less. I know that more is better for sponsers but really its a JOKE.[/quote]

You make good points. Most team events are not worth the trouble. The orgs just don't realize this. They lose anglers that really want to fish, but it's just not worth the trouble to try and make a top 3 spots. These small turn-outs are NOT good for sponsors either.

[Phil]

Something is sure going on this year, look at WON, team circuits at Don Pedro, 1 event 4 boats, another event , 7 boats. It sure is fun to retire, sit back and watch what is happening with the Orgs. And yet, finally comes a new circuit like CBC, imagine new, out of the gate, 50 boats, fun, well ran, friendly, fishing for fun, less stress, maybe time for all Orgs to step back, look, and say WOW ! What made this work all of a sudden, they must be doing something right ! Maybe could work for a future type team circuit also ? No stress of how much can I win today etc. Just a good time on the lake ? So many questions, very few answers. WCB is on the right track I believe, now if Larry just learns to listen ? So easy to fail, yet it seems easier to win win with the anglers. If it were put to a vote , I'd vote for less tournaments and more fishermen/women ! As far as the live release tank issue, what would be a fair/good price to pay to have a tank available at all tournaments, interesting and could keep me out of the wifes hair for sure ? I still like the old idea take your fish out a mile or so and release them back into the lake.

Phil

[BMX Bassin]

Stick it stickman
One thing we will have to wait and see about is if 90% is payed back to 2nd and below at West Coast.........After I win the Harley.

P.S. stirring the pot is putting 2 major tourneys on the samer day.

[Fast Eddie]

No Comment
Tight Lines,
Fast Eddie