I have never seen WORSE

[Rod Wynn]

fish landing skills than what I seen today on the Elite Series Clear Lake episode by Byron Velvick..

WTF was that!!!?

and YES I know "it worked" and "oh well he won" but come on you can't tell me that is a good way to land a fish..

[Team Pollard]

Whats wrong with what he did? most of the fish he caught were hooked good, its whay better then flooping the fish on the deck. He took his time and brought them in, Ike does it the same way my hugging the bass

[Rod Wynn]

Whats wrong with what he did? most of the fish he caught were hooked good, its whay better then flooping the fish on the deck. He took his time and brought them in, Ike does it the same way my hugging the bass

Well I didn't like how he hand lined like 5-10 feet of line to get the fish up to "hug" it..
Why not just reel the fish up then land them..


BTW..Ike is crazy for ripping line off his reel manually as well..
Why not use your drag, I mean thats what it's for right?

[duckhuntr07]

Apparently it works for both of those guys. Cahed more checks that most people I know.

Besides, when you fish a "NO Nets" tourney, ya do what you gotta do. Definitely better that swingin em.

[Doug Warren]

The reason he is doing that is because I don't think you want the fish to come up to the top and shrash around with a swimbait in her face.

[Rod Wynn]

Apparently it works for both of those guys. Cahed more checks that most people I know.

Besides, when you fish a "NO Nets" tourney, ya do what you gotta do. Definitely better that swingin em.

LOL!
I knew this type of response was coming..
I guess if something "works" then it's the best way to do it then, right?

BTW.. I never said to swing them in, I just think he could reel up a lil more line before getting them in the boat..
What if the fish wants to make another strong run while you have the line in your hand?

[duckhuntr07]

Settle down big guy, I never said it was the best way. Just said it works for them. And I don't see you up there.

If you watched, the fish did run a couple times when he was hand lining them and he still got them in.

Besides like Doug mentioned, if you reel her up to the top and she thrashes around with that SB in her face she has a better chance of throwing it due to the weight of the SB.

[Rod Wynn]

Settle down big guy, I never said it was the best way. Just said it works for them. And I don't see you up there.

If you watched, the fish did run a couple times when he was hand lining them and he still got them in.

Besides like Doug mentioned, if you reel her up to the top and she thrashes around with that SB in her face she has a better chance of throwing it due to the weight of the SB.

Not sure where I seemed up tight or needed to "settle down" but ok..
I was just giving my OPINION on this matter and no matter if I am there or not, we ALL have landed fish before and IMO the way he is doing it is not right, IMO (which means in my opinion)
Which I am entitled to.. "Pro" or not..

[bigbass111]

Rod,

I would say that less than half of the guys on tour rely on drag. Most guys thumb drag an open bail on a baitcaster and back reel on a spinning reel. I know I do the same thing, every fish is hooked differant and the last thing I rely on is gears and washers. If its barely hooked drag will pull a hook in a heartbeat. The weight of a swimbait as you know throws hooks like there's no tomorrow. Hand lineing 5-10 feet of line when the fish is mostly worn out will allow you to release all pressure on a short burst. I was always brought up being told no-no on grabbing line, but there is a time and place for it.

If you watch alot of the video footage on tour you will see this is common...

When you can use nets its differant..

Justin

[Rod Wynn]

Rod,

I would say that less than half of the guys on tour rely on drag. Most guys thumb drag an open bail on a baitcaster and back reel on a spinning reel. I know I do the same thing, every fish is hooked differant and the last thing I rely on is gears and washers. If its barely hooked drag will pull a hook in a heartbeat. The weight of a swimbait as you know throws hooks like there's no tomorrow. Hand lineing 5-10 feet of line when the fish is mostly worn out will allow you to release all pressure on a short burst. I was always brought up being told no-no on grabbing line, but there is a time and place for it.

If you watch alot of the video footage on tour you will see this is common...

When you can use nets its differant..

Justin

I hear you but I don't fish Shimano Fireblood's, Chronarch's and Core's not to rely on my drags..

To each his own though..

PS.. I will NEVER back reel nor free thumb spool a fish..

[bigbass111]

I fish the same gear.....shimano/loomis

But I still lock it down and thumb all surges..

[Rod Wynn]

I fish the same gear.....shimano/loomis

But I still lock it down and thumb all surges..

TEHO

[bigbass111]

LOL.......

It took me 10min to figure out what the hell that meant...

[N.A.R]

LOL.......

It took me 10min to figure out what the hell that meant...

Try receiving 100 texts a week from Rod, he has got plenty!

[bigbass111]

LOL...

NO THANKS

[Morgan]

I understand what Rod is saying.

I really remember a first cast with a small swimbait, hooking a 4 pounder, realizing in my haste to get to a prime area, forgot to get out my net, my non-boater runs to the front and grabs my line, and off the fish goes right at the boat.

That would have put me in second place at that tourney. Yea, I understand.....

Morgan

[littlebailey]

nothing is better than swingin them in. say what you want, but were putting a 6/0 hook in the lip or throat of a fish and you people are worried about it hitting the deck and getting hurt? come on people. just swing em in.

[twinster38]

I also struggled watching Byron "hand-line" his fish to the boat.
I had a theory that he did that so that he could check to see if the fish was hooked "inside the mouth" before the fish was in front of the camera....
Am I the only one that noticed that he might have actually moved the hook into the mouth on that "questionable" fish? If you have the show recorded, please see if you noticed this?
The hook was originally on the outside when you first see it and then his hand covers it and it is "suddenly" inside the edge of the lip before he shows it to the camera......

I don't want to disparage a true professional, but it looked odd to me that the hook was lower on the side when I first freeze the frame??

I don't agree with this hard to interpret California DFG reg. but we saw other pros put fish back that were hooked outside to mouth....

[Kevin]

Well, he still would have won without that fish so I think it's a moot point.

[davet.]

Yeah, I'm with the anti hand-lining group. I think you lose some critical control with that much slack line pulled up, and if the fish makes a big run at the last second, I'd rather be holding the pole than the line.
But I know these guys use the line in their hands like the drag on a reel. If the fish runs, they let it, adjusting tension on the line with their fingers and just pull it back up.
I think the results speak for themselves and would'nt critique these guys in any way......to each his own.

[duckhuntr07]

Settle down big guy, I never said it was the best way. Just said it works for them. And I don't see you up there.

If you watched, the fish did run a couple times when he was hand lining them and he still got them in.

Besides like Doug mentioned, if you reel her up to the top and she thrashes around with that SB in her face she has a better chance of throwing it due to the weight of the SB.

Not sure where I seemed up tight or needed to "settle down" but ok..
I was just giving my OPINION on this matter and no matter if I am there or not, we ALL have landed fish before and IMO the way he is doing it is not right, IMO (which means in my opinion)
Which I am entitled to.. "Pro" or not..

OK, now you sound a little up tight so Settle Down Big Guy.

You opposed my opinion (oh, thanks for explaining what IMO meant) and put words in my mouth. Saying something worked isn't saying it's the best way, just worked for him that day IMO. The BEST way would definitely be subject to opinion.....IMO.

Perhaps you should send Byron an email and ask him why he does that. I'd be willing to bet he has a good reason. Or perhaps even a good educated OPINION Rod.

[2ndsuks]

This debate is simple, if you feel that hand lining is not an effective way to land your fish, then don't do it.

I'm with littlebailey, bounce um in the boat.

[Rod Wynn]

OK, now you sound a little up tight so Settle Down Big Guy.

Wow, never knew people who could interpret someones attitude thru a harmless post..
Ok.. We both are on the same page and have our own opinion..
Thanks for the insight..

[Cooch]

This is actually quite a common tactic in landing fish in a "NO NET" tournament. If you have spent much time watching these Elite events, we see this all the time. Guys will get their big fish near the boat then race to the back, plop in the seat or accross the back deck, hand line em the last few feet and then snuggle em in the boat. It is an extremely effective way to prevent bigger fish from jumping and tossing the bait and hook, then swimming away.

When you are standing up, using a 7-8' rod, most often your rod point can be 6-10 feet above the surface. Rules of gravity will dictate that when a fish is getting tension from above like this, he is likely to come straight up, jump and or thrash around on the surface. Keeping a low profile and hand-lining them from the water's level, prevents this from happening and gives the angler a higher percentage of getting that fish into the boat.

I really don't think Byron or any of these guys were doing this in an attempt to cheat by hiding the fact fish were not hooked inside the mouth. There was an observer on the boat at all times, as well as camera men close by most of the time. In the heat of the battle, and as fast and frenzied was the pace of landing those bigger fish, it's hard to imagine that these guys could have reacted and made a concious decission to hide an outside the mouth hooked fish, remove and replace the hook in it's mouth before pulling it over the gunnel.

Is it possible, sure, but I personally doubt and will give them the benifit of the doubt, They are innocent until proven guilty. I also remember them showing that one fish Byron thought was questionable, he even called Trip before romoving the hook, then went back and reviewed what they saw on the camera and decided to keep the fish. No protests on game day, no harm no foul.

[BuckSnort]

Nice post Cooch...

[twinster38]

Cooch,
Valid points on the issue of leverage. Thanks
However, I have reviewed the tape (DVR and HD TV) over and over again and I know what it shows. He called Trip after he "moved" the hook and after he "removed" the hook. You are also correct in that this fish would not have made a difference in this winning. It only makes a difference to those of us who set high standards of conduct and try to conform to the rall of the rules. To me it is a really big deal and I am somewhat discouraged by noticing this.
It kinda bugs me....

Regards

[Kevin]

The hook was in between the inside and outsde of the mouth. Byron did conform and followed the rules to a T. I watched the same video you did and it was really easy to tell that the fish was originally hooked on the very tip of the Bass's lip. Dont you think more people would be discussing this if there was actual validity to what you saw?

[Bigguyone]

I haven't taken a net out with me in quite sometime unless it is a tourney and I have a tiny 9' boat I fish at a local pond with some big fish.
I guess I did not even think about it as settin' in by tiny boat you really can't stand and no deck to flop em onto and so low to the water I have always got 'em close, set the rod down and then handlined the last 2-4' so I had more precise control than a 7'rod allows me - same reason we use a 6' rod for skippin docks and not a 8' rod....more control when shorter distance of line is "out" (from my contact point of the line to the fish).
Caught a nice one last friday and had to lip it while setting down right at the boat and it was over 25" fish and it was on my M power dropshot rod so sure the heck not gonna try and hoist it into the boat...
Having full control of the fish while it is still in the water (grabbing/lipping it) is so key with light line or tackle when you don't have a net as due to the "deadweight" on that gear one thrash from a decent fish and it is all but gone - as we all know a 3# fish thrashin while being flopped in on 6# could break the line easy...or sometimes you don't realize how "barely" a fish may be hooked til it is in the boat.

[Tin Can]

The hook was in between the inside and outsde of the mouth. Byron did conform and followed the rules to a T. I watched the same video you did and it was really easy to tell that the fish was originally hooked on the very tip of the Bass's lip. Dont you think more people would be discussing this if there was actual validity to what you saw?

How is this even possible? In between? Either it's inside the mouth or it's not. I don't see how there is any grey area here.

I have not even seen the footage in question, so I am not saying it was or wasn't hooked legally.

[elfish16]

swing the smaller ones, UNDER 8lbs, and lip the bigger ones if you can't use a net. But I don't fish derbies where aren't aloud so I net the bigguns!

[Kevin]

Tin Can, watch the video and then you'll understand.
Alot of you conspiracy theorists are wasting your time on Western Bass. Make better use of your time trying to find proof Obama wasn't born in the US or helping Oliver Stone with his next movie.