What do you all think about people following tournament boat

[kopper_bass]

Tom,
I whole heartedly agree with you 100% as to your rules as you've stated them. I do exactly the same thing and think that stuff like that does come back around to you. Most of that is all about communication and respect; nothing more.

Cheers,

Kopper_Bass

[Guest]

Kopper -

That makes perfect sense.. and in your example truthfully only you know the truth and you'll have to answer to your own conscience on that either way.

However, there are definitely times where someone is doing something so obscure and far off that it is obvious that they are being copied... and again - to copy someone for tournament gain is wrong in my opinion ---- and unfortunately it does happen too often!

I would say this -
- Wrapped boats invite it.
- Dock talk invites it.
- 2 day events invite it.
- High cost tournaments with people over extending themselves to fish them invites it!

[Ricky-S]

kopper_bass,

If you like it...then I love it.

[Guest]

ha ha ha...

If I looked at all 5000 orders from Oroville in the past week, I'd go crazy and not get any real work done!! I just orderded some stuff myself... and only 1/2 of it I plan to use - the other 1/2 is "Just in Case." Figuring out what someone is doing by what they are buying would be pretty darn tough - unless it came with a nice note like - "I really have to have these because the bite is off the hook on them right now over in XYZ Slough - I am fishing them uphill and only on the west bank with a slow retrieve pausing every couple seconds. Don't forget to put some smelly jelly on it too!!" Now that would be nice!

That'd be like hanging out at the local tackle shop and watching everything go over the counter- only x 100 and no guarantees the person ordering it is A. in the event B. wants it for this event and C. is on them. Especially with the off-limits period. Anyone ordering stuff right now is guessing at what the bite might be... just like you and I are doing for our strategies!

[JT-Madera]

Ricky-s

I do agree with your post 100% about it being just plain wrong for a fellow "competitor" ( from the same tournament) to follow another angler, who did make the cut, just to find what, when and where they are fishing..and then return to that "spot" and fish against them..

But don't you find it a compliment if they are just wanting to see " how " you made the cut..I respect other competitors water on day two...but that is another question..

I do find it kind of funny how " some " anglers from So-Cal come up north and somehow think they have found a secret spot that is only their water...even when I arrived there first...and somehow think all other anglers are corrupt and devils if they see them on the same water....I just say this because twice in the last few years, I have been jumped by So-Cal anglers saying that somehow I followed them to " their " water...that I have fished for twenty years....sometimes other anglers ego's are bigger than the true facts....sorry to get off the question....

I guess I look at fishing a little differently..I look more for patterns than a " spot "..Spots come and go, but a pattern is good forever..If another anglers pattern is the same as mine, we might see each other several times during the day..That doesn't mean I am following them to find out their secret...I am just following " my " pattern for that tournament...sometimes after a two day tournament I will stay an extra day and run the same pattern or a different one to see what I did wrong..

dang this is a good thread..again sorry if I offend anyone..not intended....

JT

[Andy Giannini]

I would not follow anybody. Especially someone who I thought a lot of. I would not want to affect their game, or quite frankly piss them off. (I like these guys.)

We get plenty of fishing to watch on tv, and a guy could always fish Pro Ams and not bring any fishing poles.

If I ran into someone fishing the same area by chance thats great, but I am not going to follow them there.

It may be within the law, and you may just be a fan, but follow someone around to spectate or learn, then ask them for an autograph. Good luck. (They might have a big foam "We're number one!" hand with a decidedly different finger pointed up!)

In fact Dean posted on this some years ago concerning Sapp. Sapper came in with a small bag, and Dean asked, "What happened?"

"We were being followed, so we stopped and fished sandbars all day."

Or something like that.

A.G.

[Tobe]

Why people keep referring to "my water vs. your water" is irrelevant to Ricky’s post.

You may be right in the fact that no one owns the water however, during a tournament you do "own" that particular area while you are there and that is why some tournaments have a rule regarding how close you can fish to another competitor or how near "his water" you can be.
I would rather think of it in the terms of my investment vs. their investment, why should any angler put in his time and money to find water, patterns or baits that are producing at that time just to have another angler get it free.

The FLW and Bass do not use this rule so most of us show consideration for each other’s space with an unwritten rule called respect.

Just remember, the toes you step on today may be connected to the *** you kiss tomorrow.

[JT-Madera]

You are correct Tobe..I should NOT have strayed from the topic...

JT

[Hollywood]

Nacl,

I don't think you could have said it better and summed it up!

H-Wood

If you are fishing at the highest levels, you are fishing for big $$$ and you have a resposibility to learn as much as you can all the time. During the actual tournament, I believe you have an ethical responsibility to respect the other guy's "water". But the minute you fail to make a cut, you're another spectator. And, if you're too stupid or too arrogant to go learn from your competitor then you're destined to miss a lot more cuts.

Just m $.02

.....NaCl

[Tobe]

For all of you people trying to justify following these competitors why don't you just muster up the balls to get their permission before you go..

If they say no problem then go for it but if they say I appreciate it if don’t , what now?

[Hollywood]

once they are done fishing and didn't make the cut, what is the difference between them and a spectator now? There is no difference in what they or a spectator is doing. Out there to watch, cheer, root them on or learn something new.

[mac (Doyle McEwen)]

Hey Ricky, my answers or rather responses pretty much said I don't think there is a problem with it, but (you knew there would be a but) I am with you on not doing it yourself..I personally wouldn't do it either..Not that there is anything patently wrong with it, it is just not the way I go about doing things..This has really been a very topic with a whole lot of good inputs..At least no one got down to mud slinging and name calling..

mac

[bryanmc]

My .02....
Former competitors vs "fans" following the leader.
The guy who didn't make the cut may follow and watch and file the info away for a later date. He may even go over to the spot later on to see just what made it so good or unique. He may or may not ever fish there in a tournament, but he uses it to learn. Maybe he doesn't even follow you. Maybe during his prefish for the next weekend's tournament he stumbles on your spot and gets on the bite. What then, are you going to claim that one of the "fans" following you was his spy?

The "fans" are going to watch and then hit the spot every time they go to the lake and maybe even as soon as the leader moves to his next spot. By the time the next tournament rolls around you won't have to worry about who gets there first, they'll all be soremouthed.

After I missed the cut in the Stren at Shasta 2 years ago I would have loved to follow Jeff Michels around the last day. Not to learn his "spots" but to see what he was doing differently, how he approached certain types of structure and what types of structure they were. He probably fishes some of the same places I do (I know he does, we've run across each other a few times during other tournaments) just differently. Never stop learning....

I suppose the answer to the original question lies in the intent. Are you trying to learn or just jump a spot? If you'r just trying to jump a spot (which may be no good as soon as the following day) you're probably wrong. If you're following to learn... why not?

[Bob Simard]

BUT that's only for me.

I very wise Elite Series angler who I look up to very much once told me when I was starting out a few years back

"If you feel it's wrong (and we all know the feeling about these Sportsmanship-type actions), then it's wrong."

I simply wouldn't feel comforitable following someone around and watching them fish - particularly after my day is over. Now - that's not to say when the Elites are here I won't be over seeing how the big guys fish areas I fish - I quite well may. But I'm not a competitor in that series.

From the other point of view, back when the BASS Opens were here I had guys roll up behind me in Prefish and actually had them start eating their lunch - 1 dude 30 minutes letting me prefish for him. Wasn't to fond of that and let him know to back the F off (even though BASS doesn't have a distance rule and I don't care if you're fishing BY me, watching is another story)

Everyone who fishes at a higher level knows THAT game - "My Water / Your Water." Example: You're going to have to make 5 or 7 casts for every 1 real cast if you have staging fish on Clearlake targeted, figured out. There's only so many sloughs, staging spots and you're going to share water. That's just part of it - it's a small pond.

It's not about arrogance, doing your homework, etc. For me, it's about giving the guy his respect and letting him alone to do his thing. Spectators are different than fellow competitors.

I'd ask myself this - if the guy may fish differently, a little more definsively, because I'm there watching - then I shouldn't be there watching.

But that's just me - others have their own code to follow.

-Bob Simard