Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

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WB Staff
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Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby WB Staff » Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:25 am

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From Restore the Delta Most of you don’t follow twitter. That’s a very smart decision.
But occasionally, something wonderful and informative pops up.

Today, we share this thread from Caleb Scoville Ph.D., Asst. Professor of Sociology at Tufts University.

"I was bombarded w/ messages about Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish,” the delta smelt, the topic of my dissertation & current book project. I wrote a short reaction piece but was unable to get it published as an oped. Here it is a thread"

Read more here: https://www.restorethedelta.org/2020/10 ... -10-14-20/

gabuelhaj
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Location: Manteca

Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby gabuelhaj » Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:47 pm

What was said, can’t be un-said. It’s the little fishes fault till eternity... :|

Good luck!
Glenn Abuelhaj

wph13
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby wph13 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:56 am

I could be wrong here but, all this article is an attack on Trump. It never said how important the smelt was. What is does or why it's so good to have.You don't eat them. One thing I do know is that it is an non-indigenous fish. So, it came here from somewhere else. I wouldn't take water from the farmers over it. I also wouldn't slaughter it either.

Hogbassing
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby Hogbassing » Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:52 am

The tiny fish is a canary in the gold mine. Taking water out of the delta takes salmon out of the commercial fisherman. It also takes money out off the community that have the weekend tourist. How about we modernize the delta and build more dams. The dams dont need to be huge. Small to medium size. Like they do in the north African countrys

BigD
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby BigD » Sat Oct 17, 2020 6:51 am

Left wing BS. A victim is always used to perpetuate the agenda. A little fishy... Spotted owl....
Its for the children..... Do you hate children? Why would you say such thing? You are a Bully! A Hater! CLIMATE DENIER! etc. Shut up and obey the lie. Print it on toilet paper. Love the Delta, Hate BS

mark poulson
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby mark poulson » Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:33 am

BigD wrote:Left wing BS. A victim is always used to perpetuate the agenda. A little fishy... Spotted owl....
Its for the children..... Do you hate children? Why would you say such thing? You are a Bully! A Hater! CLIMATE DENIER! etc. Shut up and obey the lie. Print it on toilet paper. Love the Delta, Hate BS


I think that is harsh, and unjustified. An ecosystem is "a biological community of interacting organisms and their physical environment." A healthy ecosystem is reliant on all of its parts being healthy.
If being able to make a living kills something else, find a different way to go about making your living. That doesn't mean stop farming, it means change the way you farm. Planting nut trees, which require 24/7 irrigation with subsidized water, for export means making a profit at the expense of our own ecosystem.
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Robb R
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby Robb R » Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:16 pm

mark poulson wrote:
BigD wrote:Left wing BS. A victim is always used to perpetuate the agenda. A little fishy... Spotted owl....
Its for the children..... Do you hate children? Why would you say such thing? You are a Bully! A Hater! CLIMATE DENIER! etc. Shut up and obey the lie. Print it on toilet paper. Love the Delta, Hate BS


I think that is harsh, and unjustified. An ecosystem is "a biological community of interacting organisms and their physical environment." A healthy ecosystem is reliant on all of its parts being healthy.
If being able to make a living kills something else, find a different way to go about making your living. That doesn't mean stop farming, it means change the way you farm. Planting nut trees, which require 24/7 irrigation with subsidized water, for export means making a profit at the expense of our own ecosystem.


I agree , left wing , crying at the sky BS . Ask yourself why PG&E is in bankruptcy !!! The Sierra Club convinced the PUC and our Government to only allow PG&E to cut tree's 4 feet from power lines and transformers . PGE wanted to and proposed a minimum of 16feet . THe Sierra club won because liberals want utopian style ideals . Add the Sierra Clubs added stance to reducing forest management to almost ZERO --- and you end up with millions of acres of tree's burned , hundreds of people killed , untold billions in cost . BUT , they were so strongly convinced they were doing the " right thing " in saving those poor little tree's . THe Delta should no longer support SoCal water demands , especially since they seem to control our State Government when it comes to water rights . Let them tax their citizens in SoCal for other water sources and leave NorCal alone .

mark poulson
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby mark poulson » Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:14 pm

How does any of that make using 80% of the state's water for agriculture okay, when a large part of that is for export.
It's one thing to grow food for our domestic needs, it's another thing entirely to grow nuts and alfalfa, two very water intensive crops, in a desert area for export. Stuart Resnick and his Southern San Joaquin farmers are shipping our water overseas, and they don't even pay delivery costs for it.
If Resnick stopped farming nuts, there would be no water shortages, even in drought years.
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El Jefe
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby El Jefe » Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:04 pm

Here’s the deal.... the valley is an ideal climate to grow crops. Mark.....you have zero clue about how much water almonds or alfalfa use and the fact is we use less water per acre than we did 20 years ago but farm more acreage and support more people in urban areas with virtually the same amount of water.

That doesn’t mean everyone needs to live here.... the masses could easily live in a water rich state with a less desirable climate for agriculture. That’s why urbanites should bear the lions share of the cost..... tax them till they leave and we can be a red state again.

mark poulson
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby mark poulson » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:19 am

El Jefe wrote:Here’s the deal.... the valley is an ideal climate to grow crops. Mark.....you have zero clue about how much water almonds or alfalfa use and the fact is we use less water per acre than we did 20 years ago but farm more acreage and support more people in urban areas with virtually the same amount of water.

That doesn’t mean everyone needs to live here.... the masses could easily live in a water rich state with a less desirable climate for agriculture. That’s why urbanites should bear the lions share of the cost..... tax them till they leave and we can be a red state again.


Why should the Southern San Joaquin farmers be able to farm desert land with below delivery cost public water and raise high water use crops for export?
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El Jefe
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby El Jefe » Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:30 am

Its not public water... it is “owned” by water rights holders. Furthermore, they farm in less desirable areas because of “urban sprawl” that has encroached on prime ag land.

mark poulson
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby mark poulson » Mon Oct 19, 2020 2:26 pm

El Jefe wrote:Its not public water... it is “owned” by water rights holders. Furthermore, they farm in less desirable areas because of “urban sprawl” that has encroached on prime ag land.

They don't own the water. If it were their water, they wouldn't have to pay anything, but they do. It is our public water, but, because of water laws that were enacted a century ago, when agriculture was the main industry in CA, they have grandfathered rights to the water. Agriculture is now only 2% of California's GDP, and yet it controls 80% of our drinking water. That's like having horse and buggy traffic laws take precedence over automobiles. When something is wrong, it's wrong.
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hydro
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Re: Trump’s claims about California water & a “certain little tiny fish

Postby hydro » Mon Oct 19, 2020 3:57 pm

El Jefe wrote:Its not public water... it is “owned” by water rights holders. Furthermore, they farm in less desirable areas because of “urban sprawl” that has encroached on prime ag land.


Part right . The Central valley Project under the direction of former California Governor Edmund G Brown in the 1960's built canals from the Delta to the central valley to irrigate land that had always been basically a desert . Before the plan was revealed to the public well connected insiders raced to the central valley and bought up all this desert land they could on the cheap to make huge profits once the irrigation water arrived . Large agribusiness corporations started farming the central valley project lands and slowly put the long time California family farmers out of business .
Many of these family farmers held out as long as they could before selling their farm land to developers who ripped out the crops to put housing subdivisions in their place taking this farmland out of production forever .


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